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Why Can't a Woman Be More Like a Man

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by tscott, Feb 20, 2014.

  1. tscott

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    with apologies to Higgins and Shaw

    with deep and heartfelt apologies to the wonderful, helpful, and gracious women I have met and have yet to meet on this site

    Why can't a woman be more like a man? It's a question that a straght friend and I would often bat around. We both teach, and we both have very successful wives, who would frequently drive us to distraction. Keep in mind how deeply closeted I was at the time. We often observed how much better gay men had it...except for the sex part, ugh, but even in this department in terms of frequency and adventurousness they had us beat.

    We would posit that we'd fish or sail more frequently and hear less about gutters and house chores, not that we'd let things go to rack and ruin; who is responsible for kids and their activities (yes, the younger the child the more Mummy was responsible); the great debate about who did more around the house and getting acknowledgement for said tasks. We admitted we needed more acknowledgement for doing something, because we didn't grow up doing them, and all good boys want a pat on the head. Now I"ll be the first to note the two of us were not the most politically correct individuals. It is a fact that we belong to a small group of male teachers who venture up to Black Lake for one weekend a year to drink, smoke cigars, and set off firework whose motto is "Acknowlege Your Dickness". Some may not find this amusing, those of us in that little circle find it hilarious.

    You may ask what this has to with a group of largely married, older, gay men who are in some phase of coming out and leaving their wives with varying degrees of understanding and sympathy.

    I myself am in the process of mediation. We've moved from the children and all that intails with emotion, but without any emnity. This week we've stated on finances. This has opened the hornets' nest. My wife makes a bit more than 2x's what I make. We bought unintentionally a money pit. We've no credit card debit, two car payments, my 10 year old teacher's pention, $28,000 (no liens just a note) owed the IRS for my wife liquidating her IRA to sink into the house. We've never kept seperate books, all one pot.

    Know before anyone brings it up in mediation, my wife avers she would very much resent having to pay spousal support to support my new carefree lifestyle I've chosen. Like I had a choice :***:. My only choice was to come out and be honest with everybody, or stay in the closet and be taken away to "R" wing with a stay in a rubber room. I wasn't as prepared as I had hoped I'd be when I came out to my wife. It just came out over lunch, because she wouldn't let up about a meeting scheduled with the rector of our church. I still waiting for carefree. No part of coming out and dissolving a marriage with someone I still love very much is carefree or a choice in its truest sense.

    I had no intention of seeking spousal support, except where the children were concerned. I thought it would be ungentlemanly. I still do, but it seems as if we're going to get down and play in the mud. I'll reserve further thoughts on that until next mediation. It seems to be okay to ask for 50% of what ever expenses we undertake getting the house ready to sell and such, but my return is to be only proportional to our incomes. I'm to move out and still help with the morgage.

    I'm not a child to be punished. I know I'm the one who turned the world upside down. I've beaten myself up enough for both of us. I never wanted to hurt anyone, if intent counts for anything. I don't want to intuit anymore, I don't want to play "gotcha" anymore, and I don't want to be punished anymore. I don't want to play these feminine games anymore. Be pissed, be angry, be hurt, come at me with guns blazing or come to these meetings in a spirit of mutual respect for the 25 years we've shared together. This may "just" be business, but it is personal.

    If my wife were honest with herself, she'd realize the only trump card I have is spousal support and that I do't want to play it. She has the kids, the job, family (I'm and only and both parents are gone), the friends by and large, the church, and the sympathy. My "choice" is a lot of unknowns utimately faced alone...unless I am fortunate enough to find someone like I found once before :bang:.

    So I ask the question again, why can't a woman be more like a man?
     
  2. MAXWELL45

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    If women where more like men, what would the enjoyment be in being gay? What would be anything to enjoy if women where more like men? I love and respect women, but if I am with a man, I want him to be a man and if I am with a woman, I want her to be a women. Those differences make a difference to me, but make life as a whole work better. There is a need for personal male and female personalities. The world would suffer if we lost either one and it was all the same. Oh no, keep women as they are. It works great this way.
     
  3. biAnnika

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    I find myself asking a similar question. Namely, why can't straight/bi men be more like gay men?

    I mean, sure, there are differences between men and women. Deep, innate ones. And there are damned good reasons I've been partnered successfully with a woman for 28 years. I certainly don't want women to be like men...but neither do I want them to be like most straight women I know. But I've met tons of *gay* men with whom I think I could get along...possibly even in the long term, aside from that little sexual incompatibility thing (which is far from little, as far as I'm concerned).

    Maybe your problem is similar, though...maybe the problem isn't women...maybe it's *straight* women?!
     
  4. BookDragon

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    Having read all that, are you sure you don't mean "Why isn't my wife more like me?" rather than women being more like men...
     
  5. tscott

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    ElliaOtaku - note taken
     
  6. greatwhale

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    Hi TScott!

    With regard to your negotiation woes, here is a very excellent link as to how to do it properly. Go for the Integrative bargaining or "interests-based model" as opposed to the "positional model" (well there are a few male models I could certainly engage with in certain positions...but I digress, as is my wont).

    Here's the link, and well worth the read:

    Negotiation