Closeted guy meets closeted guy?

I can't respond to your first question, because I was so deep in the closet for so long that I didn't dare look out of it. But as to whether it should be more obvious? I don't think so. From the way you describe him, if he's in the closet, he'd be pretty deep in it. The whole point of it is to not be obvious, with many of us hoping that someone else will make the first move, giving us a hand in opening that door.

Whether your Brokeback Mountain fantasy could be real, who knows. The fact that you have the fantasy says a lot, though, about your sexuality. But if you're that interested, there's one way to find out. Just tell him you're gay and that you hope it doesn't drive him away, because you value his friendship so much. And see where it goes. If you ask, you can hope he'll keep the info confidential. If he doesn't value you as much as you do him, at least you'll know.

I don't know about your specific situation--where you live, how accepting you thing your environment (family, friends, work) will be--and all that certainly weighs heavily into your situation. But if your situation isn't bad, I'd stick to what used to be my signature here:

"Some people are going to like me, and some people aren't. So I might as well be me. That way I'll know that whoever likes me, likes me.

 

Whether your friend is closeted, only he would know. That's the whole point of the closet, only the person inside knows it exists, it's goal is to be camouflaged from the outside world.

The two of you appear to have a deep friendship, maybe some would call it a "bromance". Could it be more if he were gay/bi too, certainly you hope so but would he?

Take things one step at a time. First, decide for yourself, regardless of your friendship with him, are you ready to come out as gay/bi to someone? To him? If yes, do it if you're prepared for the consequences. Only you can know what those consequences would be (at work, in town, at home, wherever).

Next, if you come out to him, take his reaction at face value, don't read too much into it whether positive or reserved. If he's reserved, give him time to process the information. He may be closeted and debating if he's ready to come out to you too, or closeted and feeling guilty that he is not in the right place to tell you yet and afraid if he doesn't it would hurt you or your friendship. There's no way to know, just give him time and space and reassure him you value the friendship above all. If he reacts positively, see how the conversation grows naturally. He may ask leading questions about who you're interested in. Be honest, but don't make it seem to him you want to jump him right there even if you're using all your will power not to. The last thing you want to do at that point in the conversation is pollute your friendship and possible relationship with lies and half-truths.

Hope it helps you evaluate the options. Only you can decide what you're comfortable doing.

 

The fact is that both my husband and I didn't come to terms with our orientation until we were in our mid / late 30s. So is it possible for him to still be in the closet. He might not even really have any conscious knowledge of his orientation the way you do.

 

Hello jnr183,

There are people of all ages in the closet, from the very young to the very old, so it is possible that your friend is in the closet just as you are; however, it is not your place to question him on it when you still need to figure out your own situation.

The things you describe sound very sweet, and certainly point to the possibility of your friend having a romantic interest in you, but there is really no way to tell this is 100% true.

If you want to test the waters -and it really depends on how daring you are feeling- you could send him one of those usual texts teling him that you miss him. If we are to assume that he will reply with a "I miss you too," then maybe you can push it a little bit further by saying something like "you don't understand... I really, really miss you John" (whatever his name is). And see what he says.

My point is you should not make a drastic move in your attempt of finding out how he feels. Taking small, calculated risks like this one -and that you should be able to back down from if the response is not positive- will give you more bang for your buck.

 

I'm with GayDad here. You have to decide whether you're ready to come out, if you're comfortable with who you are. Otherwise, though, I'm not a big fan of playing games. We've all spent too long in our closets to spend time with dancing around the issue.

When you're ready, tell him. But I don't agree with the idea of dropping hints. Not my style. But that's just me.
(*hug*)

 

Agreed...

Lies, obfuscating even hook-ups are a continuation of the closet.

I still want the same things; monogamous, trusting, loyal, passionate, love relationship (marriage). Only I want it authentically with a man.

Tom

 

Why dont you think about coming out for yourself, i'm not saying this is going to be easy for you, but if you are more accepting of yourself and come out then it wouldn't be about trying to figure out if your friend is gay or not.

If you come out and are happy with youself than if your friend is also gay then he could feel more comfortable coming out in his own time.

I think you are hopeing your friend will be gay so that you don't have to come out on your own. But everyone has to go through this process in their own time and now could be the right time for you.

 

Bro, a friend like this is in my experience one of the best persons to come out to. Write him an e-mail explaining your personal struggle with yourself. Then only after his reply try and gauge from that if he might be open to any suggestions and discussions.

 

Duende84 hit the nail on the head. He sounds like the perfect person to come out to. Do that, gauge his reaction, and you will know substantially more than you do now.

 

Your last sentence first. Please don't think of us as strangers. I think we'd all just like to be friends, albeit anonymous ones.

And then your question. As for myself, the answer is no. Certainly I had that fantasy when I was young (13, actually)--my blog touches on that. But I have for many years considered it to be just a fantasy. And in the last month, I've really internalized the knowledge that coming out, for me, requires an acceptance of myself, and an acknowledgement of who I am, to the most important people in my life. The first came to me on a Saturday afternoon, as I described in one of my first few threads here. The second is a work in progress, now only a week or two from being complete. Only then will I be able to begin looking for the emotional (and perhaps, someday, physical) connection I crave.

So I've been trying, these last four or five weeks, to live my life with authenticity and intention. I think that's what we all need to do.

As for your friend, only you know where he'll fall in the process of your coming out, whether he'll be one of the first to know, or not, but I think the self-acceptance, the comfort of being in your own skin as the person you are, has to come first.

And, like all my advice here on EC, as a certified non-expert, this is worth every penny you you've just paid for it.

Shalom.

/Ed.(*hug*)

 

Well, it's always good to start by coming out to someone you trust and have a good relationship with. If you can put your feelings for him on the side a bit, he would sure be a logical person, since you already have such a close friendship. Maybe just tell him that you don't want to weird him out or anything, but you feel like you need to tell this to a friend who you trust. Try to keep the attraction part out of it for now, because knowing you're gay may or may not be quite enough for him to process at one time. And if he asks you directly if you like him, you could probably say something like, "Jake, you're my friend. Telling you this isn't easy for me. What I really want right now is for you to stay my friend and not hate me." I would try to lay the groundwork that you value the friendship first--because really, you do, and making that clear will help HIM feel safer, given his background.

Then, you wait to see how he reacts. Just try not to envision any dramatic scenarios where he professes his undying love to you right off the bat. You don't want to build up some grand situation that might not happen. (Which is not to say it couldn't; stranger things have happened.) There may very well be some feelings there, but right now, this should be about you getting something off your chest to someone you trust.

Good luck to you. I'm really hoping for the best case scenario for you here!

 

The thing is that if you don't tell him, then you're stuck in this 'neverland' that you currently find yourself in - not out, having feelings for someone that you can't express to anyone... and I would think that your friendship will start to feel kind of hollow too - because you aren't being open and honest. This doubt that you're carrying around (that he might reject you for being gay) is already creating a wedge, even if you don't see it yet.

So I'm all for telling him. Come out to someone else first if you think that might help. A coworker, a family member...

 

jnr183,
I really think it's worth telling "Jake." I can read from your writing how your anxiety is increasing, and--above all--Jake is definitely your friend.

It's entirely possible that Jake may react poorly, but that sounds unlikely. My straight guy friends, even those I've known forever, are really okay. And this is one of the benefits of being in our 30s; we're a bit more mature.

You have a pretty good segue into this conversation: a recent breakup.

And I think you can phrase this in many different ways, but you could say that one of the struggles you had in your relationship with "Melissa" is that you have feelings for other guys.

Please, I urge you not to have this conversation by text. Email is okay, but phone is better. There might be awkward silences, but you'll get feedback right away rather than clicking "send" and waiting for a response.

As you know, you're going to have to be ready for the fact that Jake might not be in the closet at all. He might be only attracted to women. But you'll keep him as an even closer, more meaningful friend. And that's worth everything.

I'm glad that you've already come out to a few people, and you're really moving forward with your life.

But I think you need to just tell him. I'm putting my money on a sense of relief for you.

Good luck and take care of yourself!

 

You really ought to see Jake again, when his so-so girlfriend is not going to be around, and then come out to him. Make it clear that you have had reservations about telling him only because you value him so much and can't bear the thought that he would not want to be your friend if he knew, which is why you wanted to tell him in person. That you feel like he is someone you can trust with your secret even if he is disappointed in you to know it. Then see what he says, and go from there.

Maybe he will say what you want to hear; maybe it will take him more time than you have in the visit to process the information. Don't bring up how you feel about him unless he says something positive about how he feels about you. Take your time, closet doors move slowly.