I accept you, but not me.

It's not irrational at all...principally because I recognize that old struggle within myself. I was, after all, married and had kids. I had female relationships.

I found this to be the most interesting thing you wrote:

First of all, being with a guy may seem "uncomplicated", but I assure you that they are just as complicated (only differently so...but I like them anyway ). Emotional pain is a guarantee, no matter what the gender!

What pain are you referring to? Failed relationships (been there)? Sexual frustration (check)? Something else (probably)? Relationships are complicated, mostly because each loves the other in ways that may be vastly different. Misunderstandings ensue because "love" is an intangible concept, it is in the symbolic realm where words like love can have so many different meanings.

So you like guys, but maybe you don't have to be so definite or desperate to reach for a label just yet...maybe all you need to do is keep yourself open to the possibility of liking some guys...or loving one guy.

As for being scared, well, fear is not intrinsically a bad thing. It exists primarily to protect you. It is only a problem when it paralyzes you and keeps you from becoming closer to who you are. Why not wake up each day without a label but also without any inhibitions as to what gender you prefer? Why not take each day, moment by moment, with an openness to your own desires and the possibilities these desires will lead you to?

 

Nothing irrational about this at all - I can completely relate to what you're saying. I'm also still struggling to "let myself go" - like actually follow my feelings, let my guard down etc. One thing I do know, is overthinking things doesn't help. I gotta get out there & live my life. I can't say I've been hugely successful yet, but I'm trying. And it's getting easier.

I've lived at least half of my 29 years on this planet doing the opposite to what I wanted, so much so that doing what comes naturally to me feels uncomfortable. I know I've got to fight the discomfort & throw myself at life. One thing that works for me - when I start thinking too much about things, is to tell myself to leave the worrying for later. I'll write a book when I retire. I'm sure I'll have it figured out by then.

 

Damien, I'm going through some similar feelings regarding self acceptance. I always have had no problem with the LGBT community, either, and have been totally fine with people of various sexual preferences. It just never mattered to me. I also realize now that for a long time I knew I liked women but I chose not to address it or label it because it seemed too frightening to unearth, and if I could just leave it there in the back of my mind why not do so? Obviously things have changed now and I'm not content in my life ignoring or suppressing those feelings anymore. But with them seems to come a lot of fear and shame. My therapist called it internalized homophobia. As you said, all our lives we've been told not to be gay. We've had that message of negativity drilled in. She made the point that when someone comes out to us we are the one in control of the judgements being made. We're not the one feeling so exposed. So it's understandable that when the position is reversed it's going to feel scary.

I was talking to my friend about this, and he started asking me a series of questions related to himself. Things like "If I told you I was gay, would you be ok with that?" "What if I told you I was bi, and had slept with a guy friend of mine?" "What if I told you I was bi but I only ever dated one sex?" and so on. And of course my answer to all of his questions was "That's fine." He then turned it around on me and told me he was trying to make me realize if it's ok for him, it's of course ok for me too. Going through that exercise helped a little. It also helps to know you have some support in your life, not just from people on this forum (though we are happy to help!) but from people who have known you personally and are more entrenched in your life. It just kind of reminds you that no, most people aren't going to judge you or abandon you because of your sexuality (at least, I hope your friends are open like mine). Do you have any friends you can talk to like that?

 

You are not being irrational at all. You are reacting to a period of major personal and emotional upheaval and you are trying to find a way of making sense of and ordering some of your thoughts. Vent away and let's see if we can help.

I snipped that part from your posting, because it seems most relevant to what I'm going to say, but I could of snipped a few other lines besides...

...during adolescence, you also liked guys. I think it's really good and important that you accept and acknowledged that point, rather than trying to erase it from your memory as a teenage phase. You see, what we experience early in life, has a significant bearing on our physical and emotional development years later... sometimes, many years later. We try (and to some extent, succeed) in putting these events aside for a few years and then we experience a level of shock when it all comes rushing to the surface again. We shouldn't be so shocked really, as we never dealt with the 'stuff' in the first place - we just tried to bury it. The attraction to the same sex in adolescence would seem to have been more than a teen phase.

The other point I picked up in that snipped quote Damien, was that you mostly fantasised about women. MOSTLY. Elsewhere, you said that you mostly explored relationships with women and almost always felt attracted to women. Whether you consciously wrote the words mostly and almost, I don't know, but can you see how you are acknowledging that deeper, doubting feeling within you whilst writing to us?

So in one snipped quote I saw you acknowledge your adolescent feelings of same sex attraction and question your commitment to the opposite sex. Easy for me, as I'm not living it out in your shoes... not so easy when you are dealing with it though, is it?

I believe you are genuine when you say you are not homophobic towards the LGB community, but I think there is a level of internalised homophobia that you have and still are struggling with. Again, it may not be something you have been conscious of, but perhaps you are now realising it and struggling with it.

You are on a journey my friend. Some of us experience this journey early in life, others put the brakes on and try to live a so called normal life until it catches up with them years later.

Stick with us and let us help you on that journey, knowing that your feelings and emotions are both natural and normal.

 

It takes some time. I know even though I accepted other LGBT, as you, I did not accept myself. I think that's because when I thought about others, it wasn't as real, but more of an abstract concept. I didn't imagine what they did behind closed doors, etc. and therefore it was easy. yet, when it came to me, it was still ok when I thought about it in an abstract way, but then to think of the possibility of being in a relationship scared me. I thought how strange it would be to hold hands, or kiss or sex with someone of the same sex, yet it's exactly what I want. It was a definite conflict I had with myself, and so I decided to overcome it I had to be desensitized. I would go to the area in my city and walk around and watch people. And I did feel uncomfortable watching people of same-sex holding hands and acting like a couple. it was so strange because on the one hand I want that, but on the other, it seemed wrong some how. I have overcome that and now not only to I look forward to all those things, but I am comfortable with the idea. If I fantasize, nothing in me now thinks it's wrong, only natural. And I realized this the other day. I was on the metro and a lesbian couple got on. They were showing some affection, not overly just touching each other, etc like heterosexual couples often do. I looked around and everyone seemed very uncomfortable and looked away, and I was looking at them smiling thinking what a sweet couple. I hope I can have that some day. I used to be like the others, but I have no need to turn away now. This internal homophobia is a result of years of being socialized to be heterosexual and to have feelings shame for anything not conforming to that. It will take time to shed that shame.

 

It seems self acceptance is such a common element in our struggle. If we can't accept ourselves, how can we expect others to accept us? I find that the more I read EC, the more strength I get in self acceptance. When I read Linco's comments, the hairs on the back of my neck stood up, my heart raced, my hands shook...his comment about passing off teen attractions as a phase really jumped me..hard...As I look back at my teen years and all the "playing around" I did, I really felt alive, excited, complete..Only later to hide and self loathe because it was "wrong". Im 54. I hesitate jumping into gay culture because of fear that entrenched into my being as such an early age. It is powerful..and hard to overcome...Yet the more I read here, the more excited I get...It has been a year since I came out to myself and a few others...alas, for a spell I had doubts and told a few friends I was not sure..but no longer...To quote Popeye (for those who remember him) " I am, what I am"...

 

Ha, yeah. I think everone on here is probably going through something similar. We all get hung up on *what is my sexuality?* at some point. I'm not sure I'm ever going to fully resolve mine, but *gay* is the best fit for me where I am right now.

One thing that makes sense to me, when I get stuck in the sexuality overthinking loop is (to paraphrase, and plagiarise someone on reddit) to remember that sexuality is 3 things;

1.What you actually do

2.What you want to do

3.What you tell people you do

In reality, I'm not sure there's a single adult on the planet who manages to fully and permanently reconcile those three! It's a thinking tool to remind me i'm not alone - and that seems to bring me some temporary relief from the anxiety.

Just my 2p worth!

 

I love these! Ain't that the truth!

 

So many great comments and thoughts here....I think one of the hardest things for me to let go of has been the notion of the wife and kids in the suburban house with the crushing mortgage--the "normal" life that I was programmed for practically since birth. So programmed, in fact, that while I was quite aware of my fascination with guys and my complete lack of sexual interest in girls, I could never bring myself to consider the possibility of being more than, perhaps, very slightly bisexual. But here I am, two kids, wife who was a stay-at-home mom long enough that she is no longer qualified for much of anything in the job market, house that's worth less than what we owe, and the sinking realization that if I had been more open to (and aware of) my own reality, I would not have done any of it the way I did.

My boss for most of the last 15 years was a very stable and partnered gay man whom I respected and felt completely comfortable with, even as his close (female) friend and our co-worker would ask him curious questions about gay slang and bedroom activities. (When she went on one time about how bad cum tasted, I nearly blurted out "Oh, for heaven's sake, I've tried mine and there's nothing wrong with it!") I was totally comfortable with it and actually managed to live vicariously through him now and then. But despite that, I was never able to make that leap and say that I was actually gay, until nearly 2 years ago.

Absolutely, don't label yourself. Think about who you like and who you're interested in. I stumbled over the word "gay" because of the implications that I saw in it, but the fact remained that women never turned me on, guys did, and the emotional turmoil that I felt in every straight relationship I was in had less to do with knowing the person than it did with trying to make myself feel something when I just couldn't. Go with it, allow yourself to feel what seems natural to you, and it's much easier. As you said, I like guys because they're guys. And when you find someone you're comfortable holding hands with, kissing or more, and by chance it happens to be a guy, it makes even more sense.

 

So True! Thank you for those wise words!

 

Damien,
I think you're extraordinarily rational. You've recognized that sexual orientation is not necessarily absolute, and it can change over time.

Your comment about anatomy is really quite normal in my opinion. Yes, male anatomy can be quite disgusting (but less disgusting than the female version, in my experience.) So it can give one pause, "why would ever find this at all appealing?" In my experience, straight people have the same thoughts. "Why do I even like this?"

Incidentally, I am a former Melbournian. It is fortunately a place with many bright, respectful, insightful guys. I attended a school with a reputation for producing gay guys (our uniform appeared on the cover of a gay magazine.) In reality, my Melbourne classmates were far more open to talking about sexuality than when I moved to America. Bottom line: you're welcome to talk with us, but you're also in a good place to connect with others.

Although Cynthia Nixon's quote rings true for many of us; I hope that you will find open-minded respect and dialogue amid your friends and neighbours.

 

I think from all the answers so far, it's clearly demonstrated that many people have had similar experiences. I myself had a period of denial and almost fear when I started exploring more openly my sexuality and realised I may be a member of the LGBT community.

For me, I was in a long term relationship between 20 - 32 and even had kids. During that time, although I had certain feelings regarding the same gender, I never really addressed it and went no the assumption I was straight. It was only when my wife and I separated and there was the possibility I'd seek out a new partner that I really had to confront and explore my feelings honestly and openly. When I did that, it was pretty nerve wracking At the prospect of being LGBT, even though I had nothing against LGBT, but I accepted it soon enough and had never been happier that I could be honest and true to myself.

I'm sure the same will be true for you. There is nothing more liberating than being able to express yourself honestly and it takes real courage to do so.

Happy days