all the lonely

I am not so sure its a location specific issue. Having lived in quite a few places myself, cities both big and small as well as sophisticated and laid back, my experiences suggests this is a common occurrence. In "sophisticated" places, people are up front about showing a lack of interest in others, in more laid back places, people might appear friendly, but as soon as you or they turn away, they are just as disinterested.

I think it all comes down to finding others socially that have similar interests. Only then can you find people to engage with productively. And I think that can be done regardless of where you live. It takes effort on your part, no one can just sit an expect relationships to develop without proactively searching for them.

 

I think you may be on to something Tom. While I think you can break through the reserve with common interests etc., I think there are very different feels to how social interaction goes in different places that sometimes make it harder or easier to find that common ground. I loved the time I lived in MA but when I initially moved to Cambridge from Salt Lake it was very strange to me that people just didn't interact the way I was used to. I make eye contact and smile at strangers as I pass them on the street or sidewalk--I always have and I probably always will. Cambridge and Boston are the only places I've ever lived where people pretty regularly sort of frowned and looked away. Don't get me wrong. I made lots of wonderful friends in MA but as far as the locals (I was in college so most people I interacted with weren't actually from the area) there definitely was an extra wall to get through.

If you find the right place though I think it can cut the other way. We live in Chicago and I think of it as a very open and friendly town. We recently visited San Francisco, though, and were absolutely blown away by how open and friendly everyone was--I mean sort of weirdly so. We went almost everywhere on foot and of course we have all the GPS map things on our phone and after the first couple days we stopped using them because it was easier--and more fun--to just ask a stranger. Every local we talked to would not only give us directions, but make suggestions and have a little conversation about our vacation and how we like San Francisco. On a couple of occasions people actually just dropped what they were doing and took us to where we were going. Almost everywhere we went strangers would make conversation--whether it was restaurants, bars, stores or just standing waiting for the bus, and not like that "how long have you been waiting for the bus" stuff, like real conversation. It was strange and wonderful.

I guess I would just say that people move for a lot of reasons and the prospect of a better social life strikes me as one of the better ones.

 

In my experience it's something that can differ even within the same city. As you know my city isn't exactly a metropolitan, after my divorce I sold my house and two years later settled into an apartment literally a block away. The difference was shocking, I went from prolonged dog walks where there was at the very least some sort of a greeting with every single person I came across to being looked at like I had two heads for giving a nod or w good morning.

Other than people I'd known before hear I went something like six months before any stranger I'd crossed returned any pleasentry. Since I've made more of an effort to be social in the last few years I've noticed it's not something that's necessarily confined to where I live it seems society in general or at least society here has moved that way. I hold the door open for people anywhere I go-it's how I was raised and it never ceases to amaze me how pretty much nobody's resoponds with even a thanks or a smile.

 

I've been struggling with regional social realities much of this year. I feel very socially isolated at the best of times, and we won't even go into how hard this time of year can be. One focus for this year was to try and make friends, and reduce social isolation, before the crushing depressing holiday season hit. My expectations were low: I just wanted friends. And the friends could be just good, but not the best of friends. Just people who tolerate a gay guy with whom I might be able to do stuff.

And I had about zero success.

I sort of assumed it was all about me, and my social limitations. But...this last summer, I began hearing that it's as bad for others in my area. And some of those people--some of whom I only heard about--don't strike me as being people who should have had problems.

I can't say exactly what is wrong here. Partly because I don't know other places that well, partly because I'm too close. It seems like an informal area (almost automatic first name basis), and superficially friendly. But getting anything with depth is harder.

A lot harder.

For example, I did two extended regular attendance periods at a nearby church. One from Easter 2013 until summer someplace, and then the end of Advent 2013 through just before Easter 2014. And I formed zero real connection with anyone, even though I did all the "right" things, like participating in small groups, and attending coffee hour every week I went.

Not sure what I'll do. Problem is, moving doesn't seem viable. Plus I have no idea where I might even move to.

Do I just give up, and face a life alone, with no more than very casual connections? Do I keep trying? And try what? Meeting as many people might help--it increases the odds--but it is also really draining for an introvert. Plus...I have no idea where to go next to meet people. Or do I try something different, and, if so, what?

 

I do feel the isolation and have some of the same thoughts as BMC77. I've been blessed though with a gay resort/campground near to me where people are very friendly and open. I talk with the guys from other cities and hear them say they feel they're isolated too (Pittsburgh, PA and Columbus, OH)... these cities have large gay communities and support is readily available compared to the 1100 person town I live in redneck land So is it location or person based? Don't know for sure... maybe both??

 

I think it's important to remember that while coming out can be a very freeing experience that often makes us feel more open and at ease with ourselves, it also doesn't change who we are inside. It may allow aspects of yourself that you've kept under wraps for years to come out, but it isn't going to change your core personality a whole lot.

I've always been an over-sensitive, awkward introvert. Never got close to people, never had a lot of friends, never had a lot of social contact. I could blame it on being in the closet, but really, if I look back to my childhood, I was like that as long as I remember, and it might have been compounded by being in the closet, but it probably started with some weird parental programming, combined with just an introverted personality type. We are all different, after all. My straight brother had a posse of friends whom he's still close to; my straight sister who is closest to my age (11 months apart) has a similar personality to mine, with few or no connections; and my baby sister who is apparently bisexual to a degree has always been more sociable, along the lines of my brother. So I can't really point to being gay as the thing that made a difference one way or another. We all grew up in the same small town with the same parents. Why are we so different? Especially when the 2 straight ones are opposites, as are the gay and bi ones?

I can see changes in my level of confidence since coming out, and I'm more comfortable in groups than I ever was. But I'm not an extrovert any more than I was before--just a much higher functioning introvert. I've made some connections in the gay community but not a whole lot of close ones. A few years ago I would have looked on that as a failure or as rejection or a lousy pool of people to choose from. But if I were to be realistic about who I am today, I'd say that there ARE people I could connect with, but I'm just not good at it, and I have enough other things to do that I'm really not all that willing to put forth a lot of work to be social. Some days it bothers me. I'd love to have a bunch of people to hang with and be friends with. Or....would I? If I'm not great at social interaction, maybe I'm better off keeping it to a minimum, but picking the venues so that I can be at my best. Which would NOT include bars or hookups for me--not because I think creeps hang out in bars and yes, I know some of the people in bars ARE creeps, but certainly not all). And it takes me long enough to get to a level of comfort with someone that a hookup would be awkward, not so much because I'd think it was wrong, but really because I'd be pitifully inept at it.

The thing is to recognize who you are and what you're good at and what you're not. If you can develop an understanding of your strengths as a person, and the kind of person you want to be, it will become more obvious where you need to go to find like minded people who you'll fit in with. And I found it much harder to feel lonely once I realized that as tantalizing as the social contact seems, I'd rather not participate in a lot of it, because I just don't enjoy it that much--and I really, truly value my time to myself. I'm not saying be a hermit! You don't want to be the weird gay guy down the street with 19 cats who never leaves his house. But use coming out as a way to come to a better understanding of yourself, because if you know who you are, you project that image very clearly and the right people can pick up on it. Lord knows my qualities don't have a lot in common with a huge part of the gay community, but if you send out the right level of confidence and understanding and self-awareness, surprising things can happen.

 

Probably both, at least to a degree. While I am excruciatingly lonely where I live, and have just about given up any hope of ever having even the most casual friend, there are people who do OK here. One introvert I talked to last summer, in fact, has lived in many different places, and has had no problems with WA.

So, while I take comfort in knowing it's not all my fault, I do realize that part of the problem I face is simply who I am.

That said...I gather there are places where it's easier to form social connections, and that should theoretically make it easier for someone like me who has a hard time making friends.

---------- Post added 7th Dec 2014 at 05:26 AM ----------

I'm not out except to people who don't actually know me (e.g. the membership of a local PFLAG). Although I suppose many people are guessing I'm gay...

That said, I have noticed that I'm doing better with groups since about the time I joined EC. Not sure if it's the coming out to myself, or if the whole period has been a period of change in general...

Although, like Choirboy, I am not anywhere near being an extrovert--I'm introvert who functions a bit better in groups that he once did.

 

I think this is well worth considering. And, independently, I have long since come to the conclusion that certain paths aren't going to work for me. I'm an introvert, and large scale activities are not likely to be a good choice. I am not interested--at this point, at least--in having hundreds of friends. I'd rather have quality, rather than quantity. Etc. Unfortunately, I have mentally stalled when it comes to figuring out what to do find someone suitable for a strong introvert like me. Book discussion group is rife with introverts, but most seem to have zero interest in connecting with new people. Just show up, talk about the book, and then bolt back home to hide out with the next month's book appears to be the modus operandi of most members. Church event attendance failed. Various other activities failed. So...I have to figure out what next.

The only positive I see in this whole f:***:g nightmare struggle is this: if hell freezes, and I make a decent friend, I'll probably be more appreciative of that friend than would be the case otherwise.

 

THIS. all of it. This exact thought is what usually sets me off on a path into a dark room. Let me explain. I have a vivid imagination. All my life I have imagined how my life could/would be better if X would occur. X being various things including money, relationships, losing weight, etc. etc. It gets old very, very quickly especially when I do nothing to change it. And I know that these things usually will not magically transform me. However, the one thought that I cannot shake is that if I was in an environment that was "target rich", meaning I would have to move to a completely different area, that maybe I could find someone (anyone?) that might at least want to go out on 1 date with me. I don't mean to sound pathetic because I am truly speaking in a practical way. I have spent my entire adult life trying to figure out what in the hell is wrong with me to make me repel everyone. I admit I am not going to be a model EVER, but it can't be boiled down to just looks. And although I am probably more of an introvert than an extrovert, I am still social in situations. So can it be location? Let's blame it on that. (But in the end it's still my fault because I won't leave.) Currently, I live in the middle of absolutely nowhere. Cornfield conservative hilljack 1950's Mayberry and I absolutely HATE it. I think it is probably the one thing that I truly dislike about my life at this point. But would I ever do it? Move? Sometimes I swear I could just drive off. I am not married, no kids, but I have a family (parent) situation that I'm afraid is my cross to bear. And I guess my job. I really like it and finally after 20 something years of seemingly constantly searching for a place to work where I feel a part of something, I think I might have found it. I wrote in an earlier post about my worst fear and this is a continuation....in fact this is the actual fear sentence. That I am stuck here until (what I feel is my obligation to) my parent is gone (re: died), and then it will be too late. I'll be too old. Too over. Done. That's it folks. I said it. I feel awful about feeling that way. I feel awful about being this old already, and not moving on, letting it get to this point. So either way I pretty much feel awful. Aww Shit. Does this even relate to this post, cause when I started out it was supposed to. Sorry for the long ramble.