Is my Hubby closeted?

Hi Thelma, welcome to EC!

Let's start at the beginning (you can be quite explicit if you wish, anonymity is what we're all about): what specifically makes you suspect he is gay?

 

Guten tag

We're here to help, as above what makes you think he is gay?

 

As you can read from previous similar threads on this site no one is going to make hurtful comments or mock you.

Welcome to EC.

 

How can we help?

 

I'm not middle aged, nor closeted, so take my words with a grain of salt.

To be honest, he just seems disinterested. With the exception of looking at guys and not looking at women it's difficult to say with certainty whether he has interest in sex with men. If he really is, he's covering his tracks exceptionally well.

However, you didn't mention about how happy if at all you are with your relationship. Many couples have alone time, a private dinner, watching a film, talking about personal stuff, etc. Are you doing that? Is it possible that he's disinterested because he's not into vanilla sex, but strongly prefers bondage and costumes? What about children? Do you want children? What about him?

I wonder if your problems stem from a lack of communication rather than him not being interested in sex with women.

p.s. If you really want to get a definite answer hiring a private detective can help, but if he doesn't find what you want to hear you might blame yourself for it forever.

 

Hi Thelma,

Here is my quick response as a bi-married man in the closet who is in the process of coming out.

Bisexual means that somebody has an attraction to both sexes. Gay typically means primarily attracted to other guys and wanting to pursue romantic relationships. If your husband enjoys sex with men (but not wanting more), I would characterize him as bisexual as a working assumption. He could turn out gay, but that's not pertinent to this discussion.

Being shy does not make one bisexual/gay. It could indicate that he has underlying confidence issues that prevent him from coming out. This was the case with me.

Was he a (heterosexual) virgin when you married? That could explain the sexual awkwardness.

Regarding #1 - #2, these indicate that he may enjoy fetishes. Not clear this means he's bisexual.

Regarding #3 - #8, these prima facie indicate that he could be a closeted bisexual pursuing hookups with others. I did similar things.

I feel that confronting him will not be an effective way to address this issue. He will build a wall. You need to make it safe for him to talk about how he feels. I don't have specific suggestions on how to do this.

Just throwing this out there, perhaps you could introduce bondage and costumes and/or sex toys into your relationship?

I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news. Hang in there.

HTH

 

I'm a bit younger but I still have some advice.

No, bisexual does not mean gay although unfortunately we tend to label men that way. If a man is bi he likes sex with men and women- many bi men even prefer women despite also enjoying being with men as well. Many can be fully satisfied with women despite still having urges for men.

He might be gay, but It's hard to tell. Some of these things are more so stereotypes and not so being gay as well. Straight men can be shy, wear girly clothing, and shave everything from head to toe. Gay men can be super hairy and masculine. The only thing gay means is exclusive attraction to men, and not women at all, ever.

 

There is a lot of information here, so I will try to give you what I think, based on what you wrote.

First, being bisexual is not the same as gay, it is a distinct orientation. Sexual orientation is, however, on a spectrum, there is a lot of variation within bisexuality, with leanings to one gender or the other, or evenly split.

Late marriage is often an indicator of a reluctance to engage in sex with the opposite gender, what you describe of your first six months is suggestive of some issue with that, but also maybe because he hasn't been in a long-term committed relationship before. I would consider that inconclusive.

Internet porn, high sex drive, fetishisms do not necessarily indicate same-sex attraction, but they don't rule it out either. This is also consistent with sites on male bondage accessories, if he enjoys that, he is probably inquiring about his own use of them. Also inconclusive.

Knowing your whereabouts and durations of absences suggests (but does not confirm) that he may be engaging in extra-marital activities, but you need to rule out other possibilities before coming to that conclusion.

The one you characterized as a big thing is indeed the strongest evidence. It is often the way gay guys can recognize each other; by observing where the eyes wander to. I would characterize this is probably the strongest evidence you have of same-sex attraction. The question is: is he acting on this?

Losing weight and dressing differently are definite signs of an effort to become desirable, long or sudden absences are also a sign that something is going on, shaving down there is definitely a sign of wanting to change his appearance, it is often a gay thing as well.

His reaction to your confrontation is like a forced non-chalance, as if he is fearful of "protesting too much" or perhaps subconsciously wishing that you do find out. Saying "you have no proof" suggests also that he feels he has been successful in hiding his tracks, and therefore you can't prove anything...

On balance, I do believe there is something going on, but none of us here can say for sure, only you know him as well as anyone can be known.

The bigger question is how to deal with this. You may confront him, but he will deny. When under the spell of denial and self-repression, closeted married men can really be blind to what would be obvious to others.

I think there is enough in what you have described to consider this a crisis in your relationship, it is happening to both of you. It is really important to understand that he probably had no intention of "doing this to you", it is more likely that he is not happy being who he is, and is trying, perhaps desperately to live an alternate life.

I would like you to check out this TED talk on infidelity by Esther Perel, and try to see it in light of what she is saying.

You are at a crisis point, and it will be very easy to feel angry and/or confused. He needs to own up to his behaviour, there has to be full disclosure and this may not happen without couple's counseling.

If you choose compassion over righteous anger, there may be a way out of this situation relatively unscathed. As Perel states, if infidelity is confirmed, your marriage as you knew it will no longer be the same, it may end if you have incompatible orientations, or it may become a different marriage...but it won't be the same anymore.

I wish you both all the best. By the way, there is a movie being released in July, it's Robin Williams' last movie, called Boulevard, and it is very much about a closeted gay man in a marriage, I haven't seen it but the plot could be very much applicable to your situation.

 

I'm not middle aged, but I wanted to throw my two cents in...

[ I redacted most of my post as @greatwhale said my point better than I did ]

I'm concerned about #6; dissapearing on a sudden errand and not taking all the things you need to do the errand is a tell. If he left to fill the BBQ tank, forgot the tank, was still gone for hours and never came home with anything, I'd be suspicious. The errand was a ruse because it obviously didn't get done. However, this does NOT prove his sexuality; he's not gay because he's sneaking out the house.

Sexuality is rarely absolute and there are self-identified gay men who are somewhat attracted to women, either only sexually or maybe slightly romantically.

 

Talk to husband. We have no answers in reality only conjecture that coul make things worse.

Talking with him is way to go.

 

Sexuality is rarely absolute I agree, but I don't think a gay person can have literal sexual attraction to the opposite sex....since that would make them bisexual. To clarify I don't use a rigid definition either- if you find the opposite sex good looking, and even enjoy them in porn It's not sexual attraction.

Also you can be 95/5 in percentage and still be bi....It's not so clear cut.

 

Original poster, your list of things your husband is doing are telltale signs of *something* going on. Once I realized I was gay, I would sneak out of the house and make up stories, started to become interested in losing weight, obviously paid even more attention to guys.

You're in a difficult situation because there's no certainty he is gay, or that he's cheating. Your post contains a lot of signs that there is something going on though.

Regarding your husband's perceived non-emotional attachment to guys, for some guys homosexual activity is limited to sex but not an emotional attachment. The problem with sexuality is it's almost never binary ("gay or straight"). Rather people are varying shades on a spectrum of sexuality between gay and straight. Very few people on this forum are 100% gay or 100% straight. Society however thinks you're one or the other, which is grossly oversimplified. You can be sexually attracted to both but only romatically/emotionally attracted to one.

I would recommend reading Gareth Thomas' book Proud. He was the first our professional Rugby player and he goes into great detail about his struggle with sexuality being married in a straight relationship. It was wholly relatable for myself, but also opened my eyes to what married gay men have to go through realizing (or coming to terms) with their sexuality later in life.

 

Aside from considering his sexuality, I think you should consider whether he might also have Asperger's/be on the Autism spectrum. Many things that you mention are compatible with someone who is - physical and/or social awkwardness, lack of sexual interest in person but sometimes an obsession with internet porn, latecomer to relationships and/or marriage, thoughtlessness or forgetfulness/absentmindedness, poor communication skills and difficulty connecting emotionally with a partner, genetic ties where one or both parents also have the same issues...

The list of signs for High-Functioning Autism (as it is now officially called) is LONG, so you would do best to research it a bit and see if when you read about it, it sounds like it fits your husband.

Your husband might still be gay or bisexual, I am not sure about that, in addition to having HFA/Aspegers, or he might be neither. But it is worth looking into, because it is possible he simply has a curiosity about sex with men, or is bi but monogamous with you, and Autism characteristics are leading you to draw the wrong conclusions. A lot of straight men on the Autism spectrum are confused by straight women for being gay because something about the interaction is definitely off and they seem disinterested, plus they are often obsessive or have different mannerisms in ways that some women are think are stereotypically gay. So it's worth looking into this and being sure this is not part of the equation, in your search for what is going wrong in your marriage. A lot of people have never been diagnosed and have no idea they have it.

 

This is a very real possibility. I'm an aspie, and while I'm completely functional (as long as I take my antidepressants) I still have many quirks that are actually quite similar to his. I think the posters above have quite eloquently summed up my thoughts on it as well, but I wish you well as a fellow Michigander.

 

Why you would want to hire a PI or resort to other clandestine tactics? If you love your husband, wouldn't you want to help him come to terms with his sexuality rather than trying to make this a confrontation? There was an incident before my wife and I got married that raised questions in her mind (A former classmate attacked me at a party. I hadn't touched him or any other guy at this point in my life). When my wife probed, this forced me further into the closet, though I was able to deny in good faith that I hadn't touched another guy.

Sometimes I have far fetched ideas that are either really brilliant or really stupid... This is one of them.

Why don't you leave this thread on your shared computer for your husband to discover?

Food for thought - just sleep on it. This is one of those high risk/high reward ideas I have. Please think this through and see if it's right for you before acting.

You should also check out greatwhale's advice. He is wise and pragmatic in these matters.

Best of luck you to you.

 

The dictionary definition of "gay" is "men who have sex with other men". We usually make the distinction around here of being emotionally attached to other men, or simply liking to have sex with other men. The Kinsey Scale (Google it) describes male or female attraction as a range of exclusive attraction to men at one end and exclusive attraction to women at the other end, but with people able to be at any position between those extremes, some with attraction to BOTH men and women. Kinsey X means "asexuality; no attraction at all, male or female", so it is really not on the scale of attraction.

The Kinsey scale also has nothing to do specifically with "kink"; some people enjoy various types of physical interactions which are not seemingly sexual in nature, but which may have sexual undertones. This could include bondage, or abuse, or use of sex toys or appliances, or other forms of stimulation which some people find erotic or pleasurable, but they are generally not what most people would call "sex".

If he enjoys sex with men, there is a fair chance that he is having sex with men, but that is not proof that he is having sex with men.

I was also a late bloomer, probably because I was gay and did not recognize/acknowledge it at the time I married in my 40s. If you are trying to have kids, but are not getting pregnant, then you should both see a gynecologist specializing in fertility issues, as mid-forties is pushing the envelope pretty far. Being gay has nothing to do with fertility; if you are having sex while ovulating, and not getting pregnant, something is amiss physically with one of you or the other; easy to check out if that concerns you.

Not specifically indicative of being gay, but not uncommon for someone who is closeted either.

Failure to maintain an erection can have physical or mental origins, or both. At 40-45, most men don't have physical problems, and Viagra can make a difference with typical ones. It can also mean that he does not find vaginal sex erotic, which is potentially (but not positively) indicative of a gay orientation. A low testosterone level could also cause a lack of interest in sexual activity, but not necessarily direct inability to maintain an erection. He could take testosterone supplements which would stimulate his interest in having sex, but not specifically help him maintain an erection; that is more a function of the Viagra and its effect on blood flow. If he is able to masturbate to an erection and ejaculation, then he likely does not have a physical limitation to having sex and maintaining an erection. There are medical devices which can be used to determine whether he is able to have an erection, but you said maintain an erection, so I assume you mean that he is unable to sustain an erection long enough to reach ejaculation, but not specifically unable to get one initially, which suggests that his plumbing is basically working, so the problem is more likely mental than physical.

This sounds more like a mental problem than physical, but I would suggest that he get some lab work done to determine his total and free testosterone levels, to identify or exclude low-T levels as a possibility; easy and quick lab blood test. If his levels are well below normal, that would correlate with a reduced desire to initiate sex of any kind. Lab work is more reliable than intuition, and quantifiable and definitive proof if out of range on the low side.

He may be interested in kink, straight or gay. But, people look at sites all the time out of curiosity, so that is not definitive. Hundreds of pictures of women in tight clothes doesn't sound very "gay" to me. I am gay; any pictures I downloaded would be of hot men, not hot women.

Could be he wants to view porn or talk in a chat room, and doesn't want you popping in by surprise. Could be he intends to go out or have someone come in for fun. No way to know without installing a keyboard spying program to monitor his activity. If he discovers it, it could get very ugly, and he could get even more secretive about what he is doing.

That is a pretty good tell, if he is that obvious when doing it. Gay men look at other men carefully and exclusively, looking at them, and for "eye contact" if they are openly cruising. It doesn't mean that he is doing anything with them, only that he is probably interested. I looked at men for decades, but never did anything with them. It indicates attraction, not action.

Another "tell" if he is doing the scanning thing in these areas, instead of just driving through because it is a preferred route.

If he is on the computer, then signs off and leaves immediately as a repeatable pattern, then he very well could be leaving to meet "somebody" "somewhere". There are ways to track his action, but it would be a lot better to say you want to go with him, instead of clandestinely tracking him, and see what he does and if it makes sense for him to be doing it.

Another possible tell, but not conclusive of anything specific; people have many reasons to want to look better and lose weight; toning up for a boyfriend is only one of them.

Easy enough for you to look and see, and ask him why he is doing it. You could also ask if he is doing it because he wants to have sex with you and see what he says. If he is seeing someone who wants him to for the purpose of having sex of some kind, that is the primary reason, but maybe he just likes a smooth scrotum and a bicycle seat that doesn't pull hairs off his butt when he rides.

It is pretty clear that communications between you have broken down. You need to talk about these problems, and probably in the presence of a marriage counselor who can be a referee if you can't do it productively and civilly by yourselves. There is something amiss, but exactly what is not identifiable from these clues and cues. I think everyone here agrees on that much. You need more information to figure out what it is. I think you need to resolve this, and just as an aside, without getting pregnant until you work this out, if that is a consideration. If your husband is indeed gay, then you probably need to separate on friendly terms, for the health of both of you. He may have made a mistake getting married heterosexually, not intentionally, but due to various misunderstandings and external pressures to conform and be "normal", or to "make himself normal". Don't assume malice where confusion and misunderstanding may be better explanations; it was a first and late marriage for both of you, so you are both "40 year-old virgins", which is not all that different in these kind of matters from 20 year-old virgins.

It is possible. You can go on the more popular ones and make a localized fake appealing profile and see what pops up. You can also look at his search history in his browser and see what he has been looking at, or look and see if he is running specific apps that do that function, on his computer or a smart phone. You can also look on his log files to see what programs he is executing if you know how to do that. I can't say the names here, or they will just be replaced with asterisks, but they are easy enough to identify through Google searches. I would sure hope you could work this out by opening up communications with him in a non-angry and hopeful/helpful manner, rather than in an accusatory/aggressive one, for both your sakes. If you get any more definitive information, feel free to come back and share it with us and we will try to help you figure out what it might mean. (*hug*)