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America (USA) in the 60s, 70s, 80s

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by brainwashed, Jan 14, 2016.

  1. brainwashed

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    The following are my feelings based on limited research and reflection.

    I've been reflecting on the America (USA) during the 60s, 70s, 80s and it's discrimination against gay people. (I know discrimination against gay people in America picked up steam starting in the 30s - the religious types used the Great Depression to their advantage, ~"See whats happening to us (the Depression) God is punishing America because of homosexuality." - true fact.)

    In the surface (1st level) America is a country of immigrants. In the surface America loves to brag about how all it's people get along.

    On the 2nd level (just under the surface) America is a country that does not accept different people and their ways at all.

    On the 3rd level America proactively "demonizes" people who are different.

    Anyone else have these same reflections? Can you add insight, verification to my reflections?
     
  2. greatwhale

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    It was C.G. Jung who posited that America was even more prone to the "psychic infection" that brought Germany to Nazism. It starts with a basic and simplistic naiveté about America's "exceptionalism" and the inability of its citizens to see their own shadow.
     
  3. brainwashed

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    Interesting reflection and one I'm going to have to study. As generally is the case greatwhale, you've sent me off to the study corner. I love it. (I've got a backlog of research.)

    As a kid growing up in the 60s, 70s, 80s, I did all the things society and family told me to do - pound a square peg into a round hole. As an un-out / unknowing gay kid, I let them shove me into a closet and throw away the key. Now I'm out of the closet and pissed as hell.

    In 1993, 94 I finally did something for me, something I wanted to do - an Australian friend gave me the idea. I put on a rucksack and traveled the world alone. That experience, learning about others, seeing other places, learning about other religions, fundamentally changed me. I learned how intolerant Americans really are about other peoples of the world. And part of the intolerance is vetted towards LGBT people.
     
  4. SiennaFire

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    While there is some truth to what you've written, what you've written doesn't resonate with me as written. Perhaps it's the overgeneralization on the 2nd and 3rd levels. My thought process is that individuals or groups of individuals in America don't accept people who are different or demonize them, not the country itself.
     
    #4 SiennaFire, Jan 14, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2016
  5. OnTheHighway

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    I simply do not agree with such generalizations whatsoever. Are there segments of society that are intolerant? Absolutely. But as a whole to say the entire country is? I completely disagree. The problem is some people know how to use their loud voices while others just sit quietly. Just because someone is speaking loudly, does not mean those around such person agree.
     
  6. BMC77

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    I have to admit, I hadn't thought of 3 levels, but it seems like a valid way of thinking.

    There is no doubt in my mind that we have a huge heritage of dislike of "anyone different." That is not to say that everyone in the US is or was like that. But our society at large had a huge problem with treating any who wasn't white Christian decently. You learn this even the cleaned up, officially approved US History in school!

    And we've had a tendency to want everyone to be "American." Our "melting pot" aims to fully melt, and make everyone exactly the same. Although, of course, even after that happens, people may still be judged on the color of their skin. One thing that has interested me is the claim that Canada has done better with preserving ethnic group identities, and being able to co-exist. But I digress.

    And there is no doubt that society has had an often rigid view of what people do, and how they should act. Think of the 1950s sitcom, showing the "correct" American family, living the "correct" life.

    And yes, I think all of this may play a role in difficulty in accepting LGBT people. Although, of course, acceptance anywhere has been a problem. But, at the same time, I cannot help but note that it was not the US who first got marriage equality across the country. And we only got it because of the Supreme Court, not any formal law passed.
     
  7. Shadowsylke

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    This is certainly true. Even South Africa had marriage equality a good ten years or so before we got it. And, given their troubled civil rights history, that really says something.
     
  8. TAXODIUM

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    I am sitting in a very cool New Orleans neighbourhood market and drinking a very good glass of red wine while I "work" and wait for my daughter to finish an extracurricular activity.

    While the majority of people in this country are the descendants of immigrants who came *to* the United States in order to assimilate, many of us were *already* here (Native Americans, Francophones, Hispanophones, etc.) and we were *forced* to assimilate and *become* American through WASP westward expansion and the ideology of Manifest Destiny.

    So I am fascinated by the whole concept of national identity in this country because, well, my people came here from France long before the United States even existed. French is my language with my children. My ancestors did *not* come to the United States; the U.S. and American immigrants invaded Louisiana following the Sale of Louisiana.

    As a Latin Caribbean Catholic (French, Spanish and African) society, we're thankfully outside the *norm* of the U.S. here in New Orleans :wink:
     
    #8 TAXODIUM, Jan 14, 2016
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2016
  9. sagebrush

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    Maybe thinking a little differently here...

    America is in a state of unending tension between polarity and duality (borrowing a few terms from Ash Beckham's TED Talk). Two political parties continually vie for the ideological soul of the nation, "Are you Blue or are you Red?" while the individual reality is much more nuanced, "I'm actually feeling kinda purple today."

    Rapid shifts in the demographic and social landscapes frighten some folks who want to cling to "tradition" -- who nostalgically wish the country to remain in the halcyon days of yore (which never really existed in the first place). Fear of change, fear of loss (of status, power, wealth, etc.), and ignorance of the unknown bring a defensive response that manifests itself as racism, sexism, heterosexism, and other forms of discrimination.

    So instead of three layers, I see more of an ebb and flow between two states on a spectrum of tolerance, inclusion, and civil rights. The pendulum has swung far to the either/or, red/blue "polarity" side of the spectrum in the last few years (at least at the national political level). At the local level, though, I think duality is more the norm as people from all walks of life messily go about their daily lives and individual biases constantly collide. Civilization chugs along -- absorbing new people and grappling with new ideas -- and evolves in fits and starts, always striving for a new (and hopefully more enlightened) equilibrium.

    Kinda like the weather: sometimes it changes quickly, sometimes it changes slowly, sometimes it progresses, sometimes it regresses, sometimes it's calm, sometimes it's extreme, but it's always constantly on the move ... and never makes everyone happy.

    I, for one, wish for more sunshine, rainbows, and purple unicorns...