Hi folks, I live together with my other sex partner and our two kids. Not out yet except for my therapist. I can recall a conversation in very general terms we had years ago , I still did not manage to find a convincing answer to myself. Her point was, broadly speaking, why do some people would put sexuality, or their sex lives above all else and let life be defined by it? In her mind, career, family, kids, finances, etc... are far more important. Why would someone want to upset everything just for the sake of sex? After all, we are no longer teenagers (no offense intended on teenagers) and according to her, there are a lot of other things in life that are far more important than sex. When I see my family life I still don't dare to upset it just for the sake of lust and passion, although I am very close to coming clean to her about myself and my past, but unless I cannot convince myself that my sexuality must take precedence over all other aspects of my life, I would be one of those who will swear to be monogamous and try to 'make it work'.
Because it isn't about sex. Its about being honest and respecting the people who you are with. There are in fact gay guys who stay with their wives and family even though they are gay, BUT the catch is that they are also honest with their wives about the situation and they BOTH decide to stay together in the relationship. They BOTH decide that this is what is important in life, and they respect each other enough to talk about it. Lying about your sexuality for "the sake of family" is being selfish. You would be doing it because you decided it was worth it, but you didn't take into consideration your wives feelings about the situation. What if to her it isn't worth it? What if to her having sex with a straight man matters? So, it just depends what you value more. In the past, people would stay in crappy marriages for the kids and wouldn't get divorced even if they were in abusive relationships. To some people, that was worth it. Just make sure its your decision and you are living according to your own values.
Hi Mr B. As an aside: Here's where a hyphen would be really helpful, as in "other-sex partner" to avoid any misunderstandings... On a more serious note, and it is a very serious question: does sexuality define us? Is our identity tied up with who we sleep with? The homophobes would certainly restrict us to "just sex", which is why they prefer the term "homosexual" to address us, but we affirm that there is much, much more to it that just sex. Being in a relationship with a member of one's own sex has implications in all other aspects that your wife had outlined: "...career, family, kids, finances, etc..". Being gay is an identity, as smurf stated above, "it isn't about sex"...only.
Hi Mr B, It appears greatwhale and I have different interpretations of the antecedent of "we" (first bolded item). Does this refer to you and your therapist OR you and your wife? If "we" refers to you and your therapist (which is how I read this initially), then I would give serious consideration to finding another therapist with LGBT experience. One's sexual orientation - which is about sex, companionship, and romantic love - is very fundamental to who you are as a person. Assuming that you identify as either gay or bisexual with a strong preference for other men, then for you to live inauthentically as a straight man definitely has an adverse impact on your career, family, kids, finances, etc. in ways that are not always obvious.
I agree with smurf that it's about honesty between yourself and your partner, that it's very little about sex. When my ex came out, my first reaction was - we can make this work, we can figure something out. The problem was that he had already disconnected from me emotionally and had found an emotional and physical relationship before he told me anything. That was the devastating part. Here's the thing, we still co-parent, we still hold each other in high regard, we still - in our own ways - love each other. We can do that because of honesty, not because we honored a commitment we made when we were 21 and didn't even know ourselves well. A year later, and I'm glad he was honest with me. I still wish he had been honest with me before he found another relationship, but I can't change that so I don't dwell on it. I look back and see how truly disconnected we were and I can't imagine having lived in that situation for the last year and I can only think that it would have been worse by now. It's not about sex; it is so much not about sex.
Thank you for the replies so far, sorry about the ambiguities, English is not my main language but I try hard! SiennaFire, 'we' means my other-sex partner and I. Smurf, I appreciate you point about honesty, but the tough thing is, what type of coming out do I want? One that focus on making things work or one that focus on moving on. Thus my question also relates to the question of how much sacrifice I would be willing to endure for the sake of the family. Is the whole fucus on the pursue of individual happyness and authenticity here just disguised selfishness or it is something legitimate? Where is the place for the concept of sacrifice? This is just speculation but I need some insights to help me process what is going on, once I can convince myself completely things will become easier I hope!
With regard to sacrifice, there is an excellent quote from the poet Yeats I would like to share with you: It is not selfish to want to do the right thing, indeed, there is an element of tragedy when the right thing needs to be done. The crucial question, for you, is what the right thing is. As I see it, you will suffer either way. I have tried that sacrifice route and it has yielded greater pain and trouble, because I waited so long to act, and because I had a "stone heart" and could not feel anything for my wife, who deserved far more than I could give her. Yes, being there for the kids is important, but you must understand that your relationship with your partner must be just as important, and in the long run, when the kids move out, as they will, what will be left if there is nothing for you to give?
No worries Mr. B - your English is fine. What was the context of the conversation with your other-sex partner? Does she suspect that you are not straight? To address this question, it would be helpful to have clarity around your sexual orientation. Do you identify as Gay? Bisexual with a stronger preference for guys (Kinsey 4 or 5)? Bisexual with equal preference (Kinsey 3) Bisexual with a stronger preference for gals (Kinsey 1 or 2)?
This varies from culture to culture. Some cultures, personal sacrifice is expected over the harmony of family, friends, society, etc. Like you said, it depends on what you want to do. I think the most important questions is do you want to stay with her even if you come out or not? Until you answer that question, is hard to answer any other question you may have.
Wanting to be with someone should be primarily about love. Do you love your wife? Can you love her? Does she love you? Would she love you if she knew you are gay? And honestly, a conversation like like would leave me wondering about her feelings. Is she in this relationship for the things she mentioned, not love? And one thing that wasn't mentioned.....are you happy? Being in a relationship should make you happy. First and foremost, you have a right to be happy, and maybe, for you, that means being yourself.
GW: brilliant quote about sacrifice. I would also add a point on the pointlessness of some types of sacrifices. One thing is when the suffering of one is necessary in order to save the other, like letting your children board the rescue boat on a sinking ship instead of you, which I would do without hesitation. Other thing is self-harming yourself psychologically by repressing your sexuality, which causes a lot of pain whilst not benefiting anyone. If sexuality is like an energy that comes from within and you cannot switch it off, then you have to use at least an equal amount of energy in order to neutralize it. In all, this means it will take a huge toll on you and on the amount of energy you have left to do everything else, it will disfigure your personality and leave you pretty much useless for doing anything else. SF: I am not sure about my Kinsey, the problem is, after repressing for so long, I am on a discovery phase, and I feel more and more gay as I learn to listen to the signals. Lets just say that the other day I tried solo porn without using my hands and watched about 15min of a flawless young woman masturbating without getting hard. Once I switched to men, it didn't take very long. I am starting to notice that I set the bar impossibly high for women, and can spot 'flaws' very easily, whereas with naked men, they are all interesting. Now I am starting to realize that the thought of going down on someone is more appealing if the person has a phallus.Its the whole sensory experience, the tastes, smells, shapes, etc... Inamirror: I think I am starting to realize that while I love her and enjoy her company, her humour, her character, her wisdom, etc... I am not in love with her, as I find it increasingly difficult to desire her body. So the dilemma is, I would miss her terribly since I want to be with her, but I do not desire her body so much and the sex is seldom and unfulfilling.
Based on what you've written, I'm going to work on the assumption that you identify as either gay or bisexual with a preference for guys. I'm in a similar situation because I identify as Kinsey 5, which I round to gay. When I was faced with this choice, making things work or moving on, I decided that I would be happier if I ended my marriage and got to a place where I could have a relationship with another man. For me it's more than the sex. I feel much happier and more connected being intimate with another man, more so than I have ever felt with a female partner. After kissing a guy that I really care about, the light bulb went off and I realized what I had been missing. Once I recognized this, it was difficult to see myself continuing to pretend to be a happily married man. There are definitely challenges ahead of you if you choose this path - the difficult conversation of coming out to your wife and children, going through the separation process, and redefining the family structure. There are plenty of people on EC who have gone through this if that's the path you decide on. HTH
