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Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by baristajedi, Mar 29, 2016.

  1. baristajedi

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    I'm not really worrying a lot about this at this point, but I'm starting to think I need to consider just how far I am on the gay side of the scale versus the bi side.

    I don't care about it in terms of describing myself to others so much as understanding my needs. I think on some level, that will be a big driver in how I decide to live my life as authentically as I can.

    I guess it's better to say I care about what my needs are. And I'm trying to get out and explore what I feel by meeting women and engaging with the LGBT community in general.

    I'm still trying to learn whether I simply need to explore and experience a fulfilling relationship with a woman, or women, and maybe an open relationship with my husband will satisfy me, or whether I can't get my emotional, sexual, intimate needs fulfilled by my husband.

    I guess I just wanted to generate a bit of discussion on this. If any of you out there have questioned your sexuality, how did you learn what you really needed was to live a lesbian or gay life, to have a female partner (if you're female) or a male partner (if you're male)?

    Does anyone have any thoughts?
     
  2. Katchoo

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    Sounds like you're further down the road than me on this one, so I don't really have advice, but I'm very interested in this conversation.

    It sounds like there are questions you're asking other than where you are on the Kinsey scale? Are any of these things you are also asking?
    -Can I be satisfied with just one partner?
    -Can I have sexual satisfaction with just my husband?
    -Can I have sexual satisfaction at all with my husband?
    -Can I make an open relationship work?
    -Do I need to be with one or more women before I can even know what I want?

    I'm not looking for the answers from you, just clarifications on what your questions for yourself are.
     
  3. Kiran

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    I never got into thinking about how I can fulfill my own needs. That just went along the road with my relationships. I'm living my life the way I want. Spontaneously. Don't plan ahead. Whatever my relationship (who my partner) is, I'm still bi.
     
  4. SiennaFire

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    Fasten your seatbelts everyone - here's how I found the perfect label :slight_smile:
    • I identified as straight for most of my life because that was the only option on the menu growing up.
    • At midlife I accepted that I liked guys too, so I became bisexual.
    • I realized that I liked guys more than I liked gals, so I became bisexual with a stronger attraction to guys. This is where it started to get scary. Could I be gay?
    • After joining EC I made the jump to gay because it felt closer to the truth. Once I accepted and embraced the label, it gave me permission to act like a gay man.
    • I explored some non-brand-name labels (homoflexible and homoromantic bisexual).
    • I eventually settled on Kinsey 5 and gay. I use gay in most situations, except when Kinsey adds value to the discussion.
    HTH
     
    #4 SiennaFire, Mar 29, 2016
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2016
  5. greatwhale

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    I have stated this before, but here goes again:

    I prefer the term "working title" (gay) to describe my sexuality. It works, so I use it; but to say that it fits perfectly would be inaccurate...it is simply good enough and allows me to get on with my way too short life.
     
  6. afgirl

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    I have decided that no matter how much I don't care for the term "bisexual", well, that has to be what I am (if I must label myself as anything, which I don't think I really have to). Why? Because I don't retch at the idea of being with a man. I don't find it an impossibility. My gf is a lesbian...has absolutely no interest in having anything romantic or sexual to do with a man. It's simply not an option for her.

    I think probably the most intelligent thing I've done recently was just stop thinking and let this wonderful thing happen in my life. There is no need to know how I register on the straight or lesbian scale. I have to say ten years ago, I would not have allowed myself to experience this....I wasn't ready.

    I think ultimately it's the connection with the person that will fulfill you. Now who you can develop a connection with is what you need to discover. I truly believe everything else will fall into place.
     
  7. Adray

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    I don't know if I can help answer your questions, but I'll post my experience, too, in case there is anything there you can identify with (or find differences with).

    I find the bisexual label very positive for me, personally. I've been attracted to both men and women for most/all of my adult life. I'm definitely not straight. When I first learned the term "bisexual," it explained what I was experiencing as far as attraction. So for me, the label is important.

    I fell in love with and married a woman, so I'm in a long-term opposite-sex relationship. I'm happy and don't feel the need for anything else. Yes, I still find other women and men attractive, but I'm happy in a monogamous relationship and don't feel the need to act on anything else.

    My Kinsey tests have come out as a 3. I think I might be slightly more attracted to women, but I get a 3, for what it's worth. The Kinsey Test seems really imprecise, but I guess it's good for discussion purposes.

    So yeah, bisexual and monogamous works for me, I'm happy. The label matters to me, it explains my orientation well and is important to me. I can see where someone with a different orientation would not have the same experience that I have had, though. Perhaps exploring where your orientation is will help answer some of your questions?
     
  8. afgirl

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    Very interesting. and I can see it from your perspective. Personally I have no issue with the bisexual label, I just had to come to terms with it. It sort of felt like not making a decision, but it is.

    However, I am not so sure as you are, but you seem to be further along than me. I do consider myself bisexual, but if my current relationship doesn't work out, I don't know what would be next. I can't even venture to say what my next move would be. I mean, it would be whatever seemed right, but who's to say whether it would be a man or a woman? I mean, maybe I'm done with men and just don't know it, or maybe this is my only lesbian relationship. The truth is, the only way I'm going to know is if this relationship comes to an end. And to be honest, I don't want to drive myself mad about it, either.
     
  9. baristajedi

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    These questions are really helpful at making me articulate things more clearly, and maybe even helping me get my brain more focused.

    As far as the Kinsey scale, I consider myself a 4.5, because I consistently rank as a 4 or 5. So for me, I know I lean more towards women. But having never been with a woman... it makes me unsure as to what I really ultimately need.

    I have always felt in my relationships (with men) some missing piece, and it's hard to articulate what that is. It's something I've always described as not feeling like a team/BFF/unit/partner with the guy I'm with. I wonder lately, is that because I don't, can't really connect fully with a man? I've always been not straight. I guess I'm trying to figure out, is this (the missing connection) part of my orientation, part of my need and my pull towards being with a woman?

    So to your questions:
    - I'm not really wondering if I can be satisfied with just one partner. I think that my interest in open marriage is simply knowing that I need to be with a woman. And I wonder if being in an open marriage would satisfy that, or whether I need more.

    -Can I have sexual satisfaction with just my husband? - This is a question I'm trying to figure out. But I would add, can I have sexual, emotional and romantic satisfaction with just my husband?

    -Can I have sexual satisfaction at all with my husband? - I think that this question is in there too, but it's not explicitly something I've been questioning.

    -Can I make an open relationship work? - Yes, this is important, but I'm not yet ready to think about that. I'm still in the phase of, do I want an open relationship?

    -Do I need to be with one or more women before I can even know what I want? - This is a question I'm considering. I think that my instincts tell me that I do need to be with one or maybe more women before I make any declarations about what I want.

    I guess I would add the ultimate question - is it enough, more than enough, in fact satisfying and rewarding for me to be with a woman or women in an open relationship arrangement, or is it not enough? Do I need more, would I ultimately want the whole package with a woman, to build a life, a partnership with a woman?

    ---------- Post added 29th Mar 2016 at 04:13 PM ----------

    This is the ideal, and I think it's awesome that you are living that path :slight_smile:. For me, it's not really realistic to be spontaneous, because I'm married. Any decisions I make are decisions related to my marriage as well. But I am trying to be as spontaneous as I can within those bounds. I'm trying to explore my feelings by meeting people and seeing how I feel in the process.

    ---------- Post added 29th Mar 2016 at 04:20 PM ----------

    Siennafire, my path is fairly identical up to the part where you jumped to gay. Although I feel some instinct pulling me that way. But I think my hesitation is related to feeling like this exploration will make things obvious to me at some point. Sometimes I try on the idea that I'm gay, I just sort of assume lesbian as my identity as I go about my day. It has never felt "off". I don't know whether that means much at this point.

    ---------- Post added 29th Mar 2016 at 04:23 PM ----------

    I like that. It's true that the label we choose will always just be an approximation. I wish there was something that conveyed the meaning "very not straight". I suppose queer is the best I've found to describe that meaning.

    ---------- Post added 29th Mar 2016 at 04:28 PM ----------

    I also don't like the term bisexual. It just feels...not quite the right fit for me. I know it's technically the right term, but I think I prefer queer at this point. I don't feel bisexual. I want to say I feel like a lesbian, but that doesn't really describe my experience at this point.

    What you say about it ultimately being about the connection with the person that will fulfill you... I suppose that's the crux of my question. What person would fulfill me? I'm not sure at this point. And I think you're right about discovering that, and everything falling into place. I guess I'm doing the right things to learn that. It's just a matter of time I suppose.

    ---------- Post added 29th Mar 2016 at 04:34 PM ----------

    I think my experience, in the ways it contrasts with yours, highlights the reason I'm questioning my "label".

    I don't like the term bisexual all that much, it doesn't feel like it fits.

    I married a man, and I love him, but I've always felt some lack of passion. Though I've had passion for men before, other things have always been missing. Something akin to chemistry? connection? I don't know how to describe it honestly.

    I don't think I can be happy being monogamous with him. Although I'm drawn only to being with women outside of our marriage, I don't want to be with another man. I do feel like maybe (maybe?) an open relationship could bring me satisfaction, and alot of the missing pieces may come together. I'm just not sure.

    My Kinsey tests are always 4 or 5.

    I'm just laying all of this out here. I think it will help me think, but for now, I'm just contrasting.
     
  10. SiennaFire

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    I had a lot more baby steps behind me before I made the jump to gay, so it doesn't surprise me that you aren't ready for that jump.

    FWIW, my view on labels is that we are the master and the label is the servant tool to serve us in any way that we see fit (such as communication shorthand or guidance on how to behave).

    Here's my take on your orientation if you are interested...
    My guess is that you'll land somewhere between Kinsey 4 -5 and then you can evaluate your comfort level with the L/G label.
     
  11. afgirl

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    BTW, love this discussion. Anyway, I think you're just going to have to figure out what fulfills you through time and experience. And if you're anything like me, you could quite possibly misjudge what you think would fulfill you. Of course, it is my nature to overanalyze everything, and I fight that with every fiber in my body some days because I know that at some point it becomes unhealthy. I will say this current relationship is completely different. There is a closeness and a comfort that I've never felt with a man. I honestly don't know whether it's because she's a woman or because of something else in the relationship dynamics.
     
  12. Katchoo

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    Wow, such good conversation here today. Thanks, friends.
     
  13. baristajedi

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    I guess I have a ways to go, more baby steps to make.

    Yes, I think the label is more like a gauge for me to articulate the needs I have and how to live according to those needs. I've got to keep reminding myself that and nit get caught up in just the words.

    Ha, yeah I guess the big spoiler is I kind of already have my answer, I just don't quite know what that answer means yet.

    ---------- Post added 30th Mar 2016 at 12:35 AM ----------


    Yes, time and experience will make it clear, you're right. That requires patience - nit my strong suit! I do tend to overanalyse. I'm trying to fight that urge in my new experiences, I think i need to just let myself feel things and act on instinct.

    This closeness and comfort you're describing, I feel like that kind of describes the missing pieces I've been talking about. Now to just to get to the point where I learn where I'll find that.