Was I ever bi? Does it even matter?

COS

I get this feeling that somehow you think you should want that white picket fence, 2.5 dogs and a kid. But, you cannot get there with a woman because you cannot maintain the desire. I am no expert on this. But, you don't seem bi to me. You present pretty gay.

While it sounds like you have had a bunch of sexual experiences with both men and women. It doesn't sound like you have committed to trying that with men. I wonder if you started getting into long term relationships with women at too young an age? Maybe try a guy for more than a test drive?

The other guy did not break you up with your wife. My wife wants me to reconnect with the dude I really have the hots for. No sex just friendship. If I cannot do platonic and this causes us to break up, it was going to happen anyway. I'm not worried.

 

Y'know...it's just possible that you've repressed your desire for men *so* long and so extremely that *right now* they are the one thing you desire. And when we're in that state, it can very easily feel like it's the only thing you'll *ever* desire...possibly even the only thing you *ever have desired*.

I guess I'm positing that...assuming you are genuinely in a place where you can't tell whether you are bisexual or gay...then there could be reasons for that. And that's ok.

The (false) implication I feel like I'm reading (buried kinda deep) in your words is "if I'm gay, then I have a basis for considering whether I should stay with my wife; but if I'm bisexual, then I can comfortably stay with her." I'm one of those "genuine bisexuals", in a longstanding relationship (30 years now)...and as *absolutely perfect as we are together*, it's not a comfortable picnic, because I still have unmet needs with respect to men.

Your wife will either support your experimenting with a guy or she will not. If you're at a point where you feel it is imperative for you to experiment with guys (and it sounds like this is the case), then you should talk to your wife and let her know this is the case. Be honest with yourself and with her. If the question comes up of "are you gay or bi?" the best honest answer you can give (from the sound of what you've said) is "I was attracted to you when we married, I've enjoyed sex with you quite a bit...right now, I'm not feeling that, but possibly only because these other needs are so strong...I'd *like* to believe I'm bi and that if these needs are met, my desire for women will return." If she's threatened by that...well, she should be...it is threatening, after all. But it's honest, and it's loving, and she can decide what she wants to or can do with that.

If she cannot live with giving you that permission, then it doesn't much matter whether you are gay or bisexual...she cannot or will not support your needs...and *you'll* have to decide what you want to or can do with that.

 

Wow, this thread addresses so many of the things that I've been addressing in my life that past couple of weeks. It's funny, I felt so alone in this whole bi vs. gay thing, but reading this makes me feel more comfortable about the choices I'm making in my situation right now.

 

I used to try and convince myself that I was bi rather than gay. I intentionally ignored all the signs that said "Gay Gay Gay Gay Gay". I succumbed to all the pressures put on me and pushed off what is now the obvious.

Now, I know there are plenty of truly bi guys out there, and I respect that. I was just never one of them. And I am perfectly OK with that.

 

Based on everything you've posted up to now, you've talked about a number of issues in your relationship with your wife that aren't related to your sexuality. I feel like deciding to stay/not stay with her is a choice that comes down to more than just gay vs wife.

Also, I think in terms of your sexuality, it seems to me the thing that's lacking most is freedom. If you decided to break up with your wife, you will certainly have the opportunity to consider your sexuality (ie gay vs bi) but I think the bigger issue is that you will be on your own, making decisions just for you with no pressure or obligation to another person. From some of your posts I feel that is an area of your life that may be lacking in clarity even more than your sexuality. I feel like if you could learn to be comfortable in that freedom, it will make your decisions about your sexuality easier to grapple with as well.

 

The similarities are a bit scary. Like you my ex wife knew I had been with guys before we got married. And it remained "tucked away in a very nice package" as you articulated. She made the decision to marry me knowing the risks were there. She did it because she wanted the white picket fence, two kids and a dog and felt I was the best path for her to get that.

For me, when I look back on the moment I came out to myself four years ago, I always stipulated that it was 24 years from the time I swore off guys. That is what I at least have been telling myself, even now as I am typing this, I recognize that it in of itself is not entirely true.

The other truth that I accept, and your question is actually forcing me to accept it, is that I had always known I was gay and had actually and truly come out to myself when I was a teenager. What I did for the following 20 years was just ignore it. Heck, I even remember the night I sat in bed crying because I knew then that I was gay.

So why did I continue the charade? Because I wanted a career that could give me financial independence from my family. Independence from my family keeping their clutches on me, and independence to one day be able to live as an openly gay guy.

Unfortunately, at the time I graduated, due to a lack of confidence and low self esteem, I was unable to see clearly through the homophobic fog that surrounded me a path to independence if I attempted to do so while being out. So instead, I kept it bottled up inside and lived a straight life.

Now, with that said, we do have two beautiful girls whom we both love, that's the emotional desire we both always wanted. And she has not one but two dogs. And even now, although we are divorced, and where we have both reached a point of indifference in our relationship; a bond, a connection, an acknowledgement of what we have and what we had between us will continue to always be there. Even with all we went through, we recognize how fortunate we are. I achieved my goal of financial independence from my family. And even my ex wife has achieved her goal of having that white picked fence. The loss of the relationship we had, a 19 year relationship, shall remain bittersweet.

The day I had been saying four years ago as the day coming out to myself was not the day I came out to myself. It was in fact, the day I decided it was time to do something about it.

For the two of you, (and I see you still called her your wife although your not legally married), while you have spent a lot less time together than I had with my ex wife, where seven years is still a long time, the break up will be painful, but I also think you will have a bittersweet ending as well.

Now, how can I help you find that cute younger guy to spend your life with.....

 

I feel like you have all the answers to your questions, you just want the oomph to do what your instincts are telling you to do.

 

Oh, one more thing, stick to that June 1st move in date for the new place!

 

This ^^^ I've been wanting to say this too!

 

I can totally relate to your gay v. bi brain, and the incessant questioning. I decided a few months ago to turn it off entirely. Easier said than done, but I do my best not to let those thoughts dictate me. I was going crazy, and it was so unhealthy. I decided that I'm clearly into women, and I do find men attractive, but I'm not emotionally as into them as I maybe should be for relationships to be healthy and work out. Can you do this for yourself? Analyze the exact ways you feel about men and women, and accept that, and move forward? I know it's so hard, but it's truly a decision to stop your brain from rambling and controlling your thoughts. I still struggle with it sometimes, but I find that just accepting my sexuality and how I feel makes me feel more stable.

I also totally know what it's like for someone to come into your life and make you hyper focused on the one thing: them. I always felt like I was bi, too. It was this deep down knowledge that I understood, accepted, and mirrored onto everyone else (I thought everyone was probably bi). I never wanted a relationship with a woman though. Sex at the right time? Sure. But a full on relationship?? No way! And then I met my trigger crush, and I wanted everything with her, and I haven't been able to look back since. My attraction to women has only grown and made more sense than ever liking men.

It could have taken that one person to bring out that part of us that was hiding behind the bi. Or you could just be bi. I still say I'm bi because I do find men attractive, and who knows if I couldn't meet one and fall in love in the same way. So to answer if it matters, no. I don't think it matters if you're gay, bi, or were always gay or always bi and are now gay or are bi and leaning toward men. The being married is the complicated part. I think it's good that you're getting an apartment, which I assume is to be separated for a little while. Work on accepting who you are and how you feel. Everything might seem muddled because of the guy you were friends with, and maybe you feel like you need more guys to be completely attracted to, and find no women attractive at all to be able to say what you truly feel, but believe me, you can do it without any of that. You just need to find some quiet, and maybe write down your feelings (not only on here, but in a private journal, writing with your actual hands so your thoughts can't be back spaced) and realize and accept how you feel and how your brain works. Then you will be able to move forward, in your marriage, and in your life - whatever that means.

For me, it was understanding that I've always been a little emotionally detached from men. Found women attractive, and realizing that some of the time it was sexual as opposed to the admiration that I excused it for. Meeting a girl that I fell really hard for. Realizing I wanted a relationship with her, and that it would be satisfying in ways that I hadn't found with men. That I do find guys sexually attractive, and cute, and can like their personality, but women do something a little extra for me. So I look at women and for women, but I don't discount men completely. I'm just using my thoughts as an example, but accepting this has made me more able to move on with my life and stop spending so much time think, think, thinking about what and who I am and what it means. I hope you can get there, too!

Feel better. *hugs*

 

I think you miss my point. The experiment is seeing if sating this desire ultimately increases or brings back your desire for women...effectively determining whether you are gay or bisexual. As I understand it, that is the problem (from the thread title) to which you're seeking a solution.

To clarify...she thinks that if those are things you need, you should divorce her and go do them? Or that you should go do them and leave her out of it?

But yeah...if it's the former, then it sounds like you have your answer.

I don't (at all) get how it comes down to this. It does sound like it may come down to being with her or having satisfying sex. But being gay? That's not really a choice, right? It sounds like you at least like guys...so the operative question is whether you are gay or bisexual. You are one of these, and your decision of whether to stay with your wife cannot change which is true...it'll only change whether she's still in the picture after you figure it out.

 

I see how that can be a bit more confusing. At least you've got someone to work it out with! That's always a plus. Therapy is the best. I'm sure things will become more clear to you with time and separating.

 

I always feel a bit silly for posting in this subforum as a barely adult person but I just had to say, Yeahpldk, I relate a lot to what to what you said, and that's why I'm unable to decide if I'm bi or gay. I found it interesting to read, thanks. The other way round as it is for the OP though... that seems even harder to work out. I'm sorry, I don't have advice but, good luck!