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Navigating dating and relationships

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by jnr183, Jun 26, 2016.

  1. jnr183

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    One thing I've found with coming out is that, at 33, I'm so naive about relationships and how they are supposed to progress and what my expectations should be. For those who aren't familiar with me, I started coming out a couple of years ago and have been in a new city for the past year and have really made my first solid legitimate attempt at meeting other gay men. After running into flings that rapidly fizzle on dating apps, I've tried to simply meet friends and hope that something develops from friendship.

    Back in January I met a guy, Brian, through another gay friend (Tom). I always thought Brian was attractive and had a bit of a magnetic personality. Brian never really showed interest and never seemed like he was in 'my league'. Very comfortable with his sexuality, a bit of a reputation of being a playboy, kind of notorious around town for good and bad reasons. Over the next few months, Brian, Tom and I started hanging out more and more. It's been nice to have a group of gay friends. I knew Tom first. Brian and Tom work together. Brian and I never spent time together without Tom. Fast forward to April, Brian invites us out one night. Tom and I met him. Brian was quite drunk. Tom left early. Brian makes moves on me. I needed to leave before it got too late. Some guys he knew were with us and said everyone should kiss good night or something. I pecked some guy I had met and then went to kiss Brian and it was one of the most amazing kisses I ever had. I went home, surprised and confused.

    A few days later I texted him to tell him that I enjoyed kissing him and would want to try it again some time (corny, but I'm not a particularly smooth guy). He skirted the issue so I dropped it. The weeks passed by and we began texting more and more and then more again- fairly raunchy talk. I kept on inviting him on dates or to come over and he never obliged. I was determined to get that kiss again. I tried to try to not seem like I was trying after some time, until one night about a month ago we had been out late and at the end of the night he said he wanted to go home with me (yes!). It was very late and I had to be up in the morning. We didn't do much. He didn't try to have sex with me.

    From there we have continued to hang out more and more. We hang out with an unknowing Tom quite often. Brian is pretty keen on me Tom and Brian events. The me and Brian events typically only happen when it's Brian's idea. He's an admitted introvert, and I'd take good company over being alone any day. We've only spent the night together twice since then. It only occurs when it's late at night after we have been drinking. He's only really wanted to cuddle. And again, he has a very hypersexual non-monogamous reputation. Sometimes when he's drunk he will tell me or text me that he likes me but he'd be a bad boyfriend because he would screw my friends, etc.

    The issue at hand really now is that I'm wanting more that he isn't giving to me. I want to spend much more time with him than he lets me. We've recently spent more time together one-on-one and I always really enjoy it. There are a lot of times we should be one-on-one and he invites other friends. The problem is i feel like I'm always waiting for him to be willing. When it matters, he's come through. My birthday was last week and I spent most of the evening with just him. But at the same time I always feel like we're one cute guy or one exciting event from having the romance get derailed. He's hot and cold with texting on days when we don't see each other.

    I guess I'm not sure what to expect from him or from relationships in general. The problem is that I'm actually starting to really like this guy. He's very smart, he can be really sweet, he makes me laugh and I am extremely attracted to him. He's an interesting guy... An only child rejected by his religious parents- so he really has no family. He's been self-reliant and he did what he could to get out of his tiny town and make something of himself. I think he's softer and more complicated than he lets on but I can't be sure. I don't want to suffocate him, but at the same time I don't want to set myself up for a hard fall. I guess I haven't learned how long is too long for someone to come around and whether to gauge if he's even interested in me. The times we are together are very nice, but there is a lot of time he's without me and I don't know a single thing about what he's doing. He can be cagey, but I don't feel like it my purview to pry, because at the moment he's just a friend of mine who sometimes sleeps over. I guess I'd like this to develop into a relationship- even just a practice relationship. A friend of mine who knows Brian has cautioned me that I need a more innocent boyfriend for a first boyfriend. That Brian is too far along this path, too promiscuous, and that he's only going to end up hurting me. My argument is that he's the main guy I've met here that I quite like- why not try?

    Anyways I hope my narrative doesn't read like a trashy romance novel. I just wanted to comment on my journey and the lessons that I've learned. Writing helps me- as it always has along this journey. Any insight or conversation is welcome.
     
    #1 jnr183, Jun 26, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 26, 2016
  2. Tomás1

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    I'd not pursue him. Act disinterested romantically. Go to fewer "Brian & Tom" events. Let go of him. Play "hard to get". That makes you more appealing. I don't mean just "play" … but get on w your life. Pursue your interests. Date other guys.

    Don't sit at home being heartsick for Brian. This will either stimulate him to move closer to you, or not, if he really doesn't care. If he does move closer to you, be v firm & tell him what u want w him. Tell him m u want to try it being boyfriends, or u want to spend the night together, or whatever. Tell him what u want, make him come to your threshold - again, this makes u more appealing.
     
    #2 Tomás1, Jun 26, 2016
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  3. jnr183

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    Thanks BeingDude. I have worked on this approach before and it always requires a lot of restraint. I worry that I'm too eager to simply jump right in. Brian has played hard to get with me for a while and if anything it has only mounted my interest and anticipation. When I hold out on him he typically comes around and initiates contact. I think it's actually been quite good for me to have someone who doesn't want to just jump right in. I'm just not sure how long is too long for me to be playing this game. I have a tendency to stay in the game and hold out hope longer than I should in these types of situations. I can certainly be my own worst enemy. I have gone on other dates and tried to do other things but I don't compartmentalize nearly as well as I need to. I do feel like the friendship/relationship is progressing but am worried of being played for a fool at the end. That said, I'm going to try your approach for a bit :slight_smile:
     
    #3 jnr183, Jun 27, 2016
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2016
  4. Choirboy

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    I'm assuming "Brian" isn't his real name, but if you've ever watched Queer as Folk, it's a pretty good name to call him! If you haven't, the Brian character is a hypersexual player who has pretty much gone through the whole town, but in rare moments, you see that he's very complex and has put up a very big set of shields to protect himself because he's been rejected by his family (and has a chip on his shoulder about anyone who's straight as well).

    The one gay man on the show that he's never slept with is his childhood friend Mike, who idolizes him but is very naïve and sweet and is forever relegated to being the best friend and confidant. You're kind of the Mike in the relationship--except that you understandably want more. You and "Brian" don't have a history and you're definitely more into him than the Mike character on the show.

    You pretty much have to make a decision here. Either keep trying for some kind of relationship with him that likely won't happen, and if it does, it won't end well; or allow yourself to be someone he probably needs more than a boyfriend: a really good friend who he can talk to and feels comfortable with. The question is, of course, will that be enough? I won't say relationships can't grow out of friendship; mine did, but my relationship was pretty much a freak occurrence that I'm still kind of amazed ever came about. But friendships can be more lasting than relationships sometimes. If you can navigate through this without being forever frustrated, you may be someone that he'll appreciate in a very different way, and maybe a way that he actually needs more.

    Maybe I'm being too Pollyanna about this. Wouldn't be the first time. But if you can appreciate the friendship for what it's worth, at least with "Brian", you may have a better relationship that you could have with him any other way.
     
  5. mav96213

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    Good advice Choirboy, and the QAF tie in is spot on....
     
  6. caliwoman

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    I stopped at his confession of being a bad boyfriend. This is exactly what the woman I fell for last year told me, except it was in regards to a friendship.

    Do not pass go. Do not collect $200.

    That's my advice. One year and thousands of dollars in therapy later, just to hear that she was emotionally unavailable (which I'm assuming your guy is) and that the "bad fill-in-the-blank" isn't so much them being honest with you, rather than giving you a warning.

    "I'm a bad boyfriend, so when I hurt you- and I will- you can't blame me. You can only blame yourself, because I warned you."

    It depletes your self-esteem and drains you of your worth. You're constantly off your footing and feel confused.

    He's emotionally unavailable and there isn't a thing you can do to change that. And you shouldn't want to- unlike me who stick around to try.

    My personal advice after his "bad boyfriend" talk is to chalk it up as a learning experience and move on. At the very least, the timing isn't right. That's just me.

    And as far as a friendship, you can try that if you can adjust your expectations, but you may end up just playing the "go away, now come here" game. Well, it's a possibility.

    And lol @ the hot-and-cold part. I know how agonizing that can be. Perhaps like me, you're sticking around for the possibility of what can be, rather than the reality of what is. Just a thought.
     
    #6 caliwoman, Jul 12, 2016
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2016
  7. Highlander2

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    So true. I had one of those - but it took a lot of courage and painful discussion with him recently to tell him it was 'all or nothing'. I wasn't going to be the 'go to' person when the wheels fell off his next relationship, only for me to feel torn in two when, after pulling me close and tenderly telling me he loved me, he found a new 'shiny young thing' and I was reminded that we were just 'friends' and couldn't be more than that 'just now'. Hmmm. Don't get played for a fool. Set yourself a boundary and DO NOT cross it or let him cross it.

    It's hard - and 'He' has taken it hard, I don't think he expected me to grow a set and be firm and decisive about it. Practically begging me not to leave his life, but I couldn't be the close friend that harboured the deep love and feelings, and be close to him and have him play with my emotions when he felt vulnerable and hurt by others.

    Sometimes you have to do what is right for yourself even when it feels, at the time, like it could be the worst thing for you.
     
  8. jnr183

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    Thank you all for those really insightful posts. Your words really resonate, believe me. I think that is kind of what I needed to hear. I've been off the forum for a couple of weeks so am just seeing these messages now.

    Since I've written last I have only grown closer to him. He has opened up to me more. I'm not sure he opens up or communicates at anything deeper than a casual level with much ease. We are spending more time together. I get the sense that he has been hurt before (but who hasn't been?) and as a result he seems very guarded and careful about who he lets in. And I think that he likes me quite a bit but for one reason or another he hasn't decided what he wants to do about that yet. I've speculated about the reasons but I don't really know. Honestly, I'm almost certain that this guy isn't 'the one' for me. I think that it's within the realm of possibilities that he could be, but it seems unlikely.

    Against better judgment, I am still open to seeing where this goes. I agree that the 'bad boyfriend' comment is exactly a warning and if/when I end up hurt then I will need to put on my big boy pants and only blame myself. I'm stubborn for sure and I know that I may kick myself for thinking like this down the road. I'm knowingly playing with fire but I'm at a loss for other available men who have captured my interest. There's something so much more compelling about the mysterious man who lets you in versus the man who is an open book and just wants to be loved. I am a glutton for punishment.

    Thanks to those who read and comment. I'm sharing this because I want to share how I feel like I'm really learning about romance for the first time... something most my age figured out a very long time ago. There is excitement associated with taking a risk and I feel like this experience is just another piece of the journey and is something that I will ultimately learn from one way or another.