Hi All, It's my first post here, thanks in advance for your support. I hope I'm using this forum appropriately. I don't know where to begin with the sadness I'm feeling. I'm 43, I identify as male and gay, I've been out for more than 20 years to family and almost 25 years to friends. I'm out to friends at work; I volunteer in the gay community. I live in the Capitol Hill neighborhood of Seattle. My visible world couldn't be any more gay and I couldn't really be more out. I honestly resent being gay. My coming out to family was horrendous. I was basically outed to my family when I was 12, and the family sent me to a therapist to be "cured". Dad got out his bible and threatened to disown me if I "turned out" gay. The topic was then dropped, but the jokes, slurs, insults, and hate towards gays continued steadily through my teens. At 17 my brother held a knife to my throat (in full view of mom), and to this day the incident has never been acknowledged. As a result of fully well knowing I was gay and the danger around me I was the nicest, best, most wholesome, most compliant, most agreeable teen you could ever meet. Oddly enough back then things even seemed fine to me, and it never even dawned on me to be sad or feel loss. I was quiet on the outside and even to myself. I came out to my family as an adult at 22, and with each parent (they were divorced so there was a separate situation for each) we had anger, a falling out that lasted a few years, and lots of work to do just to even remain in contact. Over the years we maintained peace and even love, but I was largely invisible as a gay man. Today we are raising the next generation and that's our focus. My dad passed on in 2010 of cancer, and there again I postponed trying to reconcile with him just to support him, and now I grieve him without real reconciliation with who I am. In August I found out that his drawings - the only heirlooms he promised me - were not lost, not given to others, but burned. I have no words for that rage. Today the family, like most of the U.S., has "come around" - but not totally. They state their support, and yet they don't ask about my life or engage in it. They innocently say things that are ignorant, or even sometimes there is still an occasional intentional jab. We have a loving peace and stability, but I feel far from supported. My life is pretty abstract to them. As for me, it's a struggle all around. I've struggled with relationships. My longest one of 2 years ended 3 years ago, and I still miss him. For the first time I laughed with someone so hard I ached, and we had all kinds of "in" jokes and stories. Then when I turned 40 (and put on some weight from all of our eating out) he lost interest in me and wanted an open relationship. I'm just not like that. My therapist at the time told me to move on and just assimilate to gay culture and try open relationships. Well I'm sorry, I just don't reprogram myself like an alarm clock. The theme here, ironically, is exactly what I got from my family - you're not suitable as you are. I certainly don't fit in with my family of origin or in my hometown (Cedar Rapids, Iowa) - but I don't really quite fit in with mainstream gay culture, or even with the west coast model of open gay relationships either. I'm feeling really homesick and I don't even know where home actually is. This (everything I've written about above) is all known to me, I've discussed it in therapy, and it seems I at least understand it as an all too common experience for American gay men of my age. This is the stuff I know of and I've learned to manage. It's just part of me and what shaped me. The reason I write this is that I'm becoming acutely aware that something is really, really wrong inside. I'm having waves of sadness and crying for no apparent reason, I'm obsessed with death, dying, and the afterlife, and I've withdrawn a bit socially. I've managed clinical depression for most of my adult life, but this is different. Something died, or I'm grieving something beyond the previous losses themselves. Something inside me is gone. I'm having thoughts that an open gay life just isn't worth it, and the thought of living into old age as a gay man - honestly - terrifies me. More and more I feel empty and I ask myself - well, WHY is being gay so awesome? WHY should I be grateful for it? Or for that matter, why is LIVING so awesome? I can't put into words the void at the center of my being. I'm sad from the inside out. I'm spiritually broken and it shows. Honestly I struggle with thoughts that are dark and not safe. As for self care I'm seeing a therapist, I'm on an antidepressant, I eat right, I work out, I have hobbies, I engage with friends. But deep inside I just don't love myself. Something inside shut down and today I'm just going through the motions. This is deeper than depression. At work yesterday I got bad news about my performance. They're aware of my depression and they're helping accommodate it, but I'm still not performing at my level. They want me to either take a demotion or leave, and they want me to consider a leave of absence. It was a sobering realization that I'm not "just" depressed - I'm really not showing up at work and I'm really not showing up anywhere in my life. I'm going through the motions after something inside just quit or died. After all the coming out struggles, is this all there is? I went through hell coming out to my family, and after 20 years they're still not "in" my life! I've struggled to be authentic, and the real me doesn't fit with the mainstream gay community sexual ethos. I resent the homophobia and heterosexism I've personally experienced at work, the social ease of my straight coworkers, and the same "polite" detachment by society as I've experienced from my family. So, at 43 and after a long, hellacious coming out journey I would gladly be straight. Hand me the pill, give me the keys, let's push the button. Done. This idealistic notion that authenticity would bring me happiness was the pollyanna naivety of a twenty-something. A twenty-something still hanging on to being a people-pleasing teenager just trying at any cost to be acceptable to his hateful family. I'm done. I'm embarrassed to ask such basic questions - How does one accept being gay in middle age - despite setbacks and tradeoffs - and not regret coming out? How can one lose that feeling like the universe is so beautiful, but you are a void, a blemish, a mistake? Why do I hurt when I see things of beauty? How do you love yourself? I'm sorry for such a bitter post; of course this is just my stuff I'm working on and isn't directed at any of you. Thanks in advance for your help. Patrick Seattle, WA
Patrick, You have presented a lot of information, and it is clear you know yourself very well, and have for quite some time. I don't know what the "west coast model" of open gay relationships is exactly, so I'll need to have you explain this to me. I'm not clueless--I grew up in Seattle, and I lived there for more than five decades. It would be possible for me to write quite a bit, and ask you many questions about your life. Others probably will too, so I think this thread might get quite a bit longer. But for now, I'd like to start out by observing that the one thing that runs through your bio, is isolation. Isolation, to this very day. Made worse by aging, although you're not "old." Gay people often think 40 is the end of the universe, we know they do. That just makes the wall of isolation seem even higher. The middle-aged guy with the motorcycle or the Corvette would describe this as a mid-life crisis. We know you don't belong, in your family. They seem to have treated you poorly. The dysfunction seems to be ongoing, and it is not helping. But do you belong, anywhere else? I know, you have said pretty much the answer is no. But let's get really basic, day to day. How isolating is your life day to day, exactly? I know that Seattle is an awful place to try to make friends. If you walk down to Broadway and Cherry, and say "hi" to the first stranger you see waiting for the crosswalk, that look of "where's the cops?" probably will appear. So you know what I'm going to suggest.....is there any way to find a group somewhere that you can belong to? There are two reasons that I finally moved out of Seattle, when I no longer needed to live there to work. The first was the weather--February was dark and profoundly depressing. The second was that I really needed to fit in better and to make some friends. I found a place to live where it's possible to a greater degree for me than in Seattle. It's kind of ironic, isn't it, that your neighborhood is one of the most gay-friendly places in the Northwest, but you're lonely and isolated. And I know that you know that you are not the only one. There are thousands more like you there. It is sad, and such a waste. Maybe some of the thinkers here can find some suggestions to help you break out of this.
faustian1, Thank you for your very practical advice. I obviously have a lens of distorted thinking that's contributing to the depression. For years I was in a gay social events community where I felt at home, and it's gone now. I think that's part of why I feel less support. I had a wonderful experience with this group in '06, became leader/organizer and saw membership climb, and felt the vibe flourish in '06-'10 or so. Our group is obviously ten years older now, and the whole tone has changed. We're burned out as facilitators, attendance has dwindled, and the feeling is (to me at least) kind of desperate, like we're hanging on to the past. Younger people see community in mobile apps, not shared experiences, so our way of being a community through social events is probably just outdated. I know I'm over simplifying. This group had been the perfect antidote to the Seattle freeze (I don't even put quotes around that phrase anymore because it is absolutely real) and today it is no more. Since 2010 I've lost my dad, coped with two suicides in the aforementioned gay social community, seen a truly special relationship come and go, been witness to a police involved shooting at my condo building, seen the end of a community organization that I loved, and now I'm seeing shakiness in my career where a few years ago I was doing great. Is it just me, or does life just get a bit darker going from the 30s to the 40s? Am I experiencing something that's specific to being gay, or maybe life just has a different tone at this stage of life? Or I'm just depressed and filtering all of this in a pessimistic way. I'm sure that's a factor. It feels like something in life has changed in the last six years, but I'm thinking something in me has changed that I'm perceiving as an external life change. And because of my gay shame growing up I attribute it all to being gay. I just feel empty and I'm at a loss why. I don't regret living in Seattle, but it doesn't help me either. It could be time to rethink location, absolutely. Patrick
Hi Patrick, I'm not sure the trends you describe are entirely attributable to gay people and groups. I think the straight folks are involved in living it too. There is no doubt that the money and the hipsters have changed the Capitol Hill community over the last 25 years, to the point where it's all about hipsters and money now. That trend seems quite compatible with your description of how your social group deteriorated: I'm not sure you're oversimplifying at all. You have identified a movement from real social networks to electronic ones, with Wall Street and technology in the middle. And in a way similar to how high school works, those platforms end up being dominated by people who are "broadcasting" to groups of "friends" a highly filtered message, like Jerry Springer or Oprah Winfrey on a television network. It becomes impossible to have a real perception of people, and the connection that was once possible almost vanishes. It's not an oversimplification, when you can go into a restaurant and see a group of people, each person in the group glued to a smartphone instead of connecting. So if you proposed to have a real group meeting, group events, people who are vitally important to make it work just opt out. Too old-fashioned. The good news is that there is a backlash building to this, and some are recurring to the fundamental principle that human interaction worked better in the way it evolved, over a long, long time, instead of through Wall Street and Silicon Valley. It's not just you and I getting old. We just have to be aware of what we're getting into. It's so gradual sometimes, that we don't notice. In a way, we are "hanging onto the past." Sometimes, though, it's just a failure to attract the appropriate younger audience, to keep things going. I so appreciate your remarks about the Seattle freeze. Until I was about 35, I had no idea that the weird social isolation of the place wasn't normal. I stuck pretty close to home. Once I started traveling, I realized that it was different in many other places. I was shocked. There certainly are places in the United States, where gay communities like Capitol Hill in Seattle used to be still exist. They're usually a bit smaller, and definitely are not places where obscene amounts of real estate money laundering are going on.
I read the first 2 posts, I unfortunately have to leave for about an hour... But I had to post and let you know that this is the right place to come, EC has a significant number of gay guys over 40 and they are very helpful and outgoing... Im really sorry your coming out went so terrible, that is something I am working on right now... I really hope things improve, but in the meantime, EC is a great place to come vent and get support... I will be back in an hour and I will finish reading the rest and give you some of my thoughts...
Patrick, do you play any sports? Do anything Athletic? The social group has moved on, but that does not mean you can not find an alternative. New activity, new faces, new relationships. I found a running club in my area. Regular weekly runs, breakfast after, and regular social events. Lots of middle age guys involved. Now this is in the area where live, but my guess is Seattle has a group there as well. Frontrunners is an international organisation LGBT for runners. Maybe check if there is one in your area?
Patrick: That was really well written and I identified a lot with it although my story is much different (got married, had a kid, divorced, haven't really integrated my sexual attraction to other men despite therapy and gay relationships). I think your perceptions about "West Coast" gay life are accurate, and that your response to what you've been through is actually pretty rational. Were I to offer advice I would suggest you look for connection with others and meaning outside of the gay community (sorry if you've done that already and I overlooked that); in has it's pleasures but it's also a pretty narrow and superficial place, in my opinion. I would not give up on it, but I would explore organizations and interests that have nothing to do with sexuality. You're also young and you could consider a move or career change. I hope that helps in some way. Tom San Francisco, CA
IDK your politics, but I personally know there is a big Green party in Seattle, and they are pretty accepting.... I met a few of them at the Green Convention this year... But that is only if your politically inclined and all... Anyways, I cant speak to the getting older thing yet, I am only 29 now... I will get there eventually... Im just gonna "dive in" here... It sounds to me like there are a bunch of little problems stacking up. Im guessing the Seattle freeze is not weather related and has something to do with LGBT feeling isolated in Seattle? If so that means it is a seriously significant number to have you say it and faustian recognize it... Have you considered trying to work on bringing together all of the "isolated" LGBT in Seattle? I really dont have many ideas for that, and the ones I do have suck (like bowling level suck) but I cant help but think if it is that prevalent that you could find SOMETHING to unite people there... Here is a list of resources for the LGBTQ center in Seattle https://www.gaycity.org/emotional-health/ And here is there event calender, maybe you can find something there.... https://www.gaycity.org/events/ Here is a link to volunteer at the Lambert house for LGBT youth Volunteers | Lambert House That might help a little... I know when I am helping people in a relaxed non profit surrounding I tend to improve my mood.... to each his own though... Here is a list of LGBT meet ups or (not support type) group meetings LGBT Meetups in Seattle - Meetup But finally, you might want to consider therapy, because it sounds like you subconsciously know whats wrong... you hint that you think something has changed internally.... most of the info you have included is about the past homophobia you have encountered in your family, and your own internal struggle with homosexuality.. So I would bet somewhere in that area something has changed regarding your perception and with all the other changes going on with your social circle, plus your friends from the group who committed suicide (how long ago?) with all these changes, a lot for the worse, going on all at once I think it is putting you slightly into crisis mode... Do you think that being in the elevated state is why you have noticed something has changed perhaps? IDK, I am just kinda trying to poke around and see if anything sounds like it makes sense to you, because it is ultimately you who has to pinpoint the problem... Lastly, anytime your having suicidal ideations, reach out. There are hotlines available at the link I posted above, at The Trevor Project , or you can always come here, myself and many others are always willing to talk. I always used to say "this too shall pass" when I was going through tough times, but the popular one today is, "it gets better" and it does ---------- Post added 17th Sep 2016 at 12:25 PM ---------- Sorry, that is worded weird... I meant the only things you mentioned in your post about internal issues was the homophobia by your parents and your own internal struggle.. I know you mentioned a lot of other things as well, I just meant they seemed the most pertinent to something internal changing...
I don't know if things necessarily get darker as we age, but seems they often do - or we pay more attention? I think there are certain points in our timelines where we look at siblings/relatives/work colleagues and can't help but do a bit of comparison, house/spouse/kids/job/etc... Or compare with what we've been expecting for our future selves but don't really think about while we just deal with everyday stuff. It sometimes only becomes apparent in difficult events, like when a parent dies and we realize our siblings all get support at this difficult time from their bf/gf/spouse, and we're standing there by ourselves. One aspect you may want to explore is that a lot of stress and anxiety and struggle occurs when the heart and the mind aren't in sync. Usually one of them is in the wrong, and it's not necessarily always the same one either. So maybe go through those things that bring you grief and ask yourself why you think that is, and how you feel about it, and see if there are discrepancies. And I do understand what you mean about social groups going through changes - "brick and mortar" community centers are becoming less important than having a facebook page, people will sign a e-petition but won't come to a meeting, etc... That 40s-50s age group is weird for that, too old for many of the youth and young adult support and activity groups, and not yet ready for the seniors groups and early bird dinner at 5pm .
I'm in a somewhat different place (bi/not out, almost 40) but I can 100% relate to the "not fitting" the gay life of open relationships and non-relationships. It just isn't what I need and "changing myself" to fit that environment doesn't seem worth it. So you're not alone there. It's been over hyped but the above is what Alan Down's The Velvet Rage tries to address. It might offer a different perspective if nothing else. Hang in there. PC
