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Accepting loneliness...and moving on...

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by BMC77, Sep 23, 2016.

  1. BMC77

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    In the 3.5 years I've been here, I've whined multiple times about my lonely existence. I don't mean the lack of a boyfriend--I mean the lack of even basic friends. I have nothing remotely resembling a good friend locally. I really don't even have anything resembling a friend, period, locally apart from, perhaps, some very casual friends. People who may tolerate being connected on Facebook, and might put up talking with me a minute or two at the grocery store.

    This week has been a bad week for struggling with loneliness. At one point, I was honestly wondering if I shouldn't plan to stay in the closet for the rest of my life on the theory it might make finding friends easier. It's not like there really is a reason to come out--given the difficulty I have finding someone who might put up with me long enough to go to some event, it seems horribly unrealistic to even think about having a romantic relationship.

    I have also spent time--once again--going through resources that might have events that I can go to where I might meet people, and once again, I'm finding absolutely nothing. I spent time Googling to find out if there is some article that will teach me friend-making skills that I--unlike every normal person--didn't learn by the end of Kindergarten. Again, nothing of value turns up.

    And I wonder... Is it just the area I live in? There is the so-called Seattle Freeze--the difficulty of making connections with others. Is there something wrong with me? A skill I don't have? Or am I just plain unlikable?

    I'm feeling more and more worn down, and more and more hopeless. And now as this horrible week ends, I wonder something new. Is it time to just give up? Accept loneliness as the fate for me? It's probably not healthy being so alone--or so some articles say. But this constant struggle has done nothing. I am no closer to having even the most casual friend than I was when I first whined about this on EC in spring 2013. Why, I wonder, fight a war that apparently can't be won? Why not just accept loneliness, and at least free up the time and energy that I've used on this battle for hobbies and interests that I can do all by myself?
     
  2. OnTheHighway

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    What are you proactively doing to put yourself in a position to meet people. Please list five things that you are doing regularly. And then lets discuss them.
     
  3. BMC77

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    Recently, I've done very little as around here everything I have done shuts down for the summer. I had little luck finding anything happening in summer.

    Up to the summer shut down, I did one event weekly. I won't specify it--concerns about off EC identification--but it was arts related, and gave a social period. I did this almost every week, and I made a point of being there during the social period. Often I was one of the last people to leave. This event will start up again this fall; however, due to transportation problems, I probably won't be attending.

    Church attendance--two long periods (several months each) at one church, and a period at a different church. Made a point of lingering for coffee hour both places.

    As part of the church attendance, I participated in church-connected outside groups. Two different groups that met monthly.

    Book discussion group--attended monthly for a year-plus.

    Have attended countless one-time evening events, most seem to be (very broadly speaking) art related. And, again, make a point of lingering for social periods.

    The result of all this is just about zero. I casually--very casually--know/recognize a few people I didn't previously. However, no friends, and no apparent interest on their part in knowing me any better.

    I have no idea what I might do going into fall this year. Part of me is thinking maybe trying to find a way of going on with past events, even though I now have challenges I did not in the past (transportation related). Part of me thinks none of the above worked, and so it's time to try something else. I scour Meetup and such sites in hopes of finding something I can afford ($0) and get to by bus. And then a part of me thinks the hell with this! and just learn to accept being alone.
     
  4. OnTheHighway

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    Consider getting involved with other activities which require discussion, interaction and personal involvement.

    Going to art shows is nice, but the purpose of exhibits and art events is to see the art. If you are going and do not already know people, it becomes difficult to engage unless your extremely proactive and are a self starter comfortable to beginning conversations with new people (I have found people tend to be hesitant to introduce themselves and begin discussions at such events).

    If you enjoy art, have you considered taking art classes? Where in a class there is more room to meet others.

    As far as church goes, attending is one way to be involved, but like an art exhibit, it does not allow for an easy way to meet new people. That said, getting directly involved in church activities can provide a way to meet people. Joining committees and taking on direct responsibilities which require you to engage with others force you to socialize. Churches can be a great source of socializing, but to take advantage of it requires you to get deeply involved with the various avenues that are typically available.

    If you are taking the time to find an event weekly, continue to do that, but I would suggest finding events that force you to engage with other people. A cooking class, a dance class, a sports league, a social group at a local LGBT center, etc.

    The more you get intimately involved in an activity, the better your ability to connect with others.
     
  5. BMC77

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    These art-related events did have a period for social interaction. Sometimes limited to before and after the event (and I made sure I was around at least after the event). Other events allowed more interaction. Conversations were possible...although, unfortunately, it felt (to me, at least) like the regulars ended up in their own cliques...

    Based on my admittedly limited church experience, I would not say it "does not allow for an easy way to meet new people." I'd be more inclined to say: "it's a terrible way to meet new people." The only real success I had were with the smaller group activities that force interaction. Thus, were I to find a church to try, one criteria would be whether there are small group opportunities.

    The class idea has come up before, and I may consider it. But it's not possible now--all sources of classes I'm aware of charge for those classes. I am not kidding when I say I need to keep this at $0.
     
  6. OGS

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    First, if you've hit that point where it doesn't seem like anything will ever change I think it's probably time to change something radical about your life. I don't know that it's Seattle per se but it may be Seattle and you. If you've hit that point where you really feel that nothing will change that may in fact be part and parcel of the problem. My husband felt that way years ago in Oklahoma. It wasn't really the friends thing but just a general sense that nothing was moving in his life (which it seems like is how you basically feel). He threw his stuff in his car, drove to Chicago practically without a penny to his name and just started over. We met a few months later and now and the rest as they say is history. On a basic level it was kind of a foolish thing to do, but boy did it shake up his life and we're so happy he did.

    The other thing you might shake up is that you might just come out.

    I think this isn't necessarily a valid assumption. For me coming out actually made it much easier to make friends--and I came out 25 years ago when there really were more challenges in place. Oftentimes you really don't realize how much you are holding back of yourself in the closet until it's finally over--I know it was that way for me. I remember my Mother commenting that it was like I was finally really there. I remember my Father commenting that it had always been like there was this nebulous cloud between us that he didn't really understand and couldn't bridge, once he knew what it was we actually became much closer. You may find that the closet door is standing between you and people you wouldn't actually think it would--I certainly wouldn't have thought that coming out would help me have a better relationship with my devoutly Mormon Father but it did.

    My suggestion would be that if what you are doing isn't working, do something, really anything, radically different. It sounds like it may be time to really shake things up--if for no other reason than to shake up your own perspective on life. Good luck.
     
  7. CameOutSwinging

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    So here's a thought. And I don't know you personally obviously, but just something to consider.

    What if being in the closet is the reason you are having difficulty making friends?

    Hear me out. When we're in the closet, we are usually a very reserved version of ourselves. We aren't being our true selves and letting people in anywhere near enough to see our true selves. People can usually tell this in some way. Even when just making new friends, people are drawn to those who are the most open and honest versions of themselves. Being in the closet usually involves so much consideration of making sure that you're not letting your true self slip out, that it keeps you from just being fun and inviting.

    I have different realms of my life where I'm out and those where I'm not. I can totally tell the difference in how I act in each, and I know the version that is more fun to be around and has an easier time making friends is the version where I'm out and just being myself, unreserved as can be.

    I don't know that you're doing the wrong things. I think maybe you're just not letting the true you show up to these things.
     
  8. OnTheHighway

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    This is exactly the point I am trying to make. You need to get involved in activities that do exactly this! Sports leagues, classes, getting on committees and boards of organizations, all of these force the interaction. this is the key to developing relationships.
     
  9. greatwhale

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    Hey BMC, it is good to hear from you! Good or bad, I truly value your insights into what is going on in your life, and, good or bad, I hope you know that we care very much about how you are doing.

    I've heard it said once that geography is destiny...it seems like a silly notion in our interconnected world, which appears more and more uniformly homogeneous from one end of the country to the other, but here's the thing, when it comes to meeting particular people and making connections, where you are matters. It's in the nitty-gritty particulars of a particular place that very often determine your chances of making the kinds of interactions that you want and need.

    Think about it seriously, it can happen!
     
  10. pasinhose

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    there is a lot of truth to that
     
  11. faustian1

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    I read your several posts starting this thread, and I think I may be the "template" of what your future might be like. This means that we have a lot in common. You're 45; I'm about 15 years older than you are. You live in Seattle; I grew up there and spent decades there. Today I live there part time (three or four weeks a year) and have moved elsewhere. You have difficulty making friends (all the way back to elementary school); so have I.

    I am pretty sure that whether you stay in the closet or not will have a minimal effect on whether you find social success. I don't think it will make much difference. I don't think it is the cause of social difficulty for you. It is not for me.

    I know that my social difficulties are more the result of having Asperger syndrome...I'm an engineer, a technical nerd. I am very good at playing the roles, but I struggle with the unspoken parts of any social interaction. And guess what....Seattle and it's "Seattle Freeze" was poison to that disability. I moved just a few hundred miles away, and all of a sudden I am doing a lot better. I don't mean I'm a stunning success, but instead I actually am finding that I have a lot more acquaintances. And, as well, I'm working on closer friendships with more of a sense of success than I ever had. Also, the times I've traveled to the east coast or even Chicago have taught me that people are more outgoing there. In Seattle, the passive-aggressive culture is incredibly toxic for someone, who has difficulty with social cues.

    And I see from your posts that you really, really have been putting an effort into this. I have to give you credit in the extreme. Many of the things you've done are those I'd have to force myself to start. Being an introvert can be very stressful. So it's very clear that it's not just a lack of effort on your part--on the contrary, you are really putting it out there. However, if you're working with a disability in terms of social fluency and "charisma" (whatever that is), then it's going to be harder.

    You mentioned finding hobbies that are solitary. That is something I have done all my life. I also found a career that involved working with machines much more than people. And, it's clear, I get along with machines much better than I do people. The same with hobbies. I tried sports in college, but that didn't work out. So, almost all of my hobbies are "measures of individual achievement" or solitary in some way. This is something that you really should consider. I get a lot of my self-esteem and confidence from the skills I achieved doing these things, and it helps me in the social adventures I do try. I wouldn't discount the idea of following this to some degree.

    Being sexually ambiguous (my translation of your profile statement) still is a part of you, but here I argue that it's not really the problem. You stated that you had social difficulties all the way back to kindergarten, and sexuality probably wasn't driving the process then. In no way am I arguing that you suppress your sexual orientation, or even necessarily stay in the closet. However, this should probably be considered incidental to this social issue.

    If you haven't done this, can I suggest that you take a vacation (say, 2 weeks) to a city such as Boston or Providence, RI and just do social stuff and mix with people? If you're anything like I was, you'll see this as your "aha" moment, as it will contrast the awful social isolation and "freeze" that is prevalent in Seattle. The first time I (accidentally) did this, was the day I realized that my Seattle social problems weren't entirely "me" and involved an incompatible culture.
     
    #11 faustian1, Sep 23, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2016
  12. BMC77

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    Thanks. Athough as far as "good or bad" it seems like it's usually "bad" I post about... It's been so long since anything went right in my life I can't even remember what it feels like! :tears: :bang:

    ---------- Post added 23rd Sep 2016 at 11:07 PM ----------

    A possibly valid point.

    One definite issue: I do tend to have a lot of reserve, and one person commented that I tend to put up a wall around myself. Which is probably one problem I face. I'm not sure that it's closet related--the wall is more likely self protection from experiences when I was young.

    While I'm technically not out, I'm not heavily closeted as far as new people whom I meet are concerned. To a degree, with many people, I'm not out, but if they learn, they learn... And I'm pretty sure some people either have guessed, or wouldn't be surprised. At one group I attended (theology discussion), I was never out, but I'm sure some noted how outspoken I can be on LGBT issues.

    ---------- Post added 23rd Sep 2016 at 11:16 PM ----------

    I appreciate hearing from someone with similar experiences who has dealt with this area.

    I've never been formally diagnosed with Aspergers, but it's one idea that's been suggested before. (I think on some threads I've created in the past, even.) Even if I don't have it, I guess I have to think there is something not compatible with the Seattle Freeze and who I am.

    I've been the same way...which is probably why I've survived with serious social isolation. But I find it gets tiresome always being alone.

    I'm not sure I'm ambiguous in my own mind--my profile statement is more trying to be amusing... That said, I'm not sure that sexual orientation and out status are big issues. As I commented above, I'm not "closet or die" when it comes to meeting new people.
    I wish I could...but vacation with a $0 budget ain't happenin' :tears:
     
  13. BMC77

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    I was just wasting time on Meetup in the thought that maybe something will have appeared in the last 24 hours...

    By accident, though, I found out there is a group that specifically talks about the Seattle Freeze. I won't join--it's in Seattle. (I don't live in Seattle itself, and I don't have transportation to allow me to get there.) But I was interested to see that it exists, and has 10,504 members. Their name is even "Seattle Anti-Freeze."

    A quote from their page:
    This is a group for anyone who has encountered the Seattle Freeze and persisted in the face of it -- whether you're new in town and wondering why it's so hard to connect, a long-term transplant who's all too familiar with the chill, or a native who wants to break out of the Seattle shell, we're here to give you a group to hang out with and some like-minded people who are also looking for friends, not just being "Seattle nice".​

    As I say, joining is not viable...but it's nice to know I'm not alone in my struggles...

    Now back to Meetup to see if there is anything in my area that has appeared in the last 24 hours...
     
  14. faustian1

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    I'm not surprised such a group exists, but 10,504 members is rather astounding.

    I don't know if I mentioned this, but here's a nifty experiment that had an almost 100% hit rate when I lived in Seattle. It works best, with those over 40, but it's surprising how broad the trend is. If you are in a social situation, or work or wherever, and someone seems especially engaging and outgoing, figure out an appropriate point to ask them, "Did you grow up around here?" A substantial majority of time, I found that the answer was "no." If it is "no," be sure to ask where they grew up.

    I say substantial majority, but prior to 1985 or so, the result was almost one hundred percent "no." Now of course, anyone who was the president of their class in high school probably will fit the description. Stereotypes only go so far, but 10,504 people are on this page...and, I'll bet , a lot of those 10,504 people are transplants going stark raving mad trying to make friends, after moving there.
     
    #14 faustian1, Sep 24, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2016
  15. BMC77

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    Yes, 10,000+ members is astounding!

    As for the experiment, it would be interesting to try, although I suspect I already know the results! I've heard from one area outsider--just before he escaped--the comment that many--maybe all--of his friends were people who were also area outsiders.

    In a way, it's nice knowing that the area has issues. I guess I'd always sort of assumed it was my fault. My father even called me a "social misfit" about the time he was divorcing my mother, which sort of left a scar. I think I probably have issues...but I guess I now realize that it's not entirely my fault.

    Unfortuantely, it does leave me in a rather bad position. If it were 100% my fault, I could perhaps change myself, and thus start making friends. But...with the area the way it is, it's questionable if I can change myself enough to actually have much success.

    More unfortunately, moving someplace else isn't particularly viable right now. Nor is even getting up to Seattle for that Meetup group.

    I guess it leaves me with the thought I had in my original post: I just need to learn to accept loneliness...