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Reminder to married folk: What you say here appears on Google

Discussion in 'LGBT Later in Life' started by SaleGayGuy, Mar 14, 2013.

  1. SaleGayGuy

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    Hi Folks

    I was almost on the point of replacing my avatar with a real photo of myself because I now feel comfortable in coming more out of the closet to all folks on EC, up till now I had made my photo visible on my profile page to folks I had added as contacts.

    Just by chance, after reading a post by "Dublin Boy" about guest members, I had a look to see who was online and found 45 members 350 guests. Looking through the guest list I found several Web Spiders looking through the site. A web spider is an automatic indexing tool from web search engine that gathers data so that it may appear in Google or other search engines.

    After spotting a Google spider I went to Google and searched for “sale gay guy emptyclosets” and sure enough all my postings including my avatar were visible. Fortunately clicking on my username did not bring up my profile or photo as it requires a user login to do that.

    EC does make it clear that what we post on here is public and therefore can be viewed via search engines, but two months down the line after joining it’s easy to forget especially when this site is so absorbing and easy to pour your heart out to. So just bear in mind what you say on here if you are still closeted and you think your wife/husband may be tempted to do some homework on Google etc. if they are a bit suspicious of you.

    In future I think I will have to be a little more guarded about what I say about myself since information disclosed so far, although anonymous, will be instantly recognisable to my wife. :icon_redf

    So if you are planning joining EC to get help and advice, and I strongly advise you to do that it’s a great resource, make sure you pick a username that perhaps does not give a clue, however small, as to who you are.


    Sale Gay Guy
     
    #1 SaleGayGuy, Mar 14, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2013
  2. BMC77

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    And this is exactly why I avoid using a photo of myself as an avatar. In fact, I avoid it on any discussion forum, no matter how innocent. I don't want certain people from my past (including toxic relatives) to accidentally stumble across a post of mine...

    I also generally avoid pictures of myself even in the profile area. While that may require a login, it's not very hard joining a discussion forum.

    Finally, while there is always the fear that Google will cough up the wrong page to the wrong person at the wrong time, there is some value with Google: it's how I found this site.
     
  3. Maddy

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    This is why we require that users use a username that is unique to EC. It's a privacy measure that works both ways - people from here can't Google you and find you offsite, and people you know offsite can't Google usernames they know you use and find you here.

    Posts are indexed by Google as this brings a great deal of new users to EC. As you mentioned, though, profiles and albums are not visible on Google searches, so if you'd like to share a photo of yourself, it's pretty safe to put it in an album. An extra privacy measure is to create a private photo album, which can only be seen by moderators and people you haveset as your contacts.

    If anyone realises their username could lead to them being found, please post in Ask the Staff with a new username you'd like, and an admin will change it for you.
     
  4. therunawaybff

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    I would not put any pictures of myself here or anywhere else on the Internet. Once you put that shit on there, it's FOREVER. And other people can do whatever they like with your photographs.

    It boggles my mind how much personal information people put out about themselves on the Internet that can be tracked directly back to them. And some of the stuff people say on Facebook and Twitter and whatnot, like they don't really understand that what they're saying on the Net is actually representing THEM when they do it from their Facebook.

    I know two girls from my old job who both got reprimanded for posting abusive things about each other over Facebook. One of them got fired. And they didn't even do it on the clock. (And in case you're wondering how that's possible, Tennessee is a "right to fire" state. To the employer, this means that they can terminate any employee any time they want, with cause or without, with notice or without, and are under no obligation to even provide the employee with a reason for their termination. )

    You gotta be careful what you say if you're not using an anonymous handle on the Net.
     
  5. BudderMC

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    While I get the concern, keep in mind this:

    If the only reason your wife is going to find your posts is by searching "sales gay guy empty closets" she already HAS to have a reason for doing that. Which, with all due respect, means you're already past the point of feeling "safe", since she suspects something is up.

    I don't say that to discourage you from using the site; on the contrary, I hope it'll make you feel better. If your wife was planning on snooping, there's pretty much nowhere (online or otherwise) you could say something and feel safe about it. EC is pretty strict with it's security measures, so I'd argue that if you had to post somewhere, this isn't such a bad choice.
     
  6. Zach

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    This is exactly why I didn't use my real name for my account here. I liked the name Zachary and at the time I signed up the name wasn't available, so I chose Zach. :icon_wink
     
  7. SaleGayGuy

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    Hi Folks

    Thanks for the comments, I put them out there more as a reminder to others rather than because I have been caught out.

    I think it’s a great testament to this site that it’s so welcoming and makes me feel so comfortable and open in discussing my feelings with others as I come to terms with who I really am. It’s so easy to forget at times and become a little careless with what is said, but I want my comments to help other readers even though they may not be contributing to the discussion so I try and be as honest as possible.

    As an added layer of security at home I have added key-word and web address filtering in the broadband firewall so that only my computers can access the sites I use. Any attempt to look at the sites from my wife’s computers, personal or work, is apparently blocked by a web filtering service I have told her we are signed up to.

    To EC staff: I am happy with the arrangements put in place and think you have struck the right balance of forum openness to help others who don’t yet feel comfortable with a membership, but with the option of selective openness on the profile page.

    To BudderMC: As far as I know my wife has never attempted to search for me or anything related to sexuality on the internet, I think any suspicion she may have would come from my wandering eye whilst out in public. Just for clarification my username is not used anywhere else.

    Sale Gay Guy
     
  8. Chloe

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    EC avatars that are used elsewhere can be found through Google Image Search. I had to replace mine - not because I didn't want to be found (it was indirectly linked to my books that I'd like to promote), but because EC requires us not to allow anyone to find us off-site.

    Almost anything posted anywhere has the chance of appearing where you don't want it. I never post anything relatively specific to me, such as my town, birthday, or local organizations. Under my pen name, I never post anything I wouldn't want the public to see. Because I make an effort to be visible online (as an author), I take extra precautions with what I post and how it could be linked to the real me. People who want to post personal info on EC under a unique username (and avatar) should feel comfortable if they follow a few basic posting guidelines.

    I once tried a search with the combination of my first name and "BDSM" and it turned up one of my professional publications. I didn't use that term in my article, but someone discussing my article did. The lesson there is that while posting a real first name can be safe, if it's unusual, you might want to avoid posting it anywhere (I mean in specific posts, not your profile). Some of my friends were careless about using my real nickname in public posts, so I've stopped telling people my real name. I have to take these extra steps because I'm trying to make my author identity more public.

    Another tip - when possible, don't use the same email address for your online life and private life. Some programs connect them in surprising ways. I was once contacted through what I think was the alternative email address I had supplied.

    I once created a screen name that turned out to be related to someone in my real life. I actually received an email with that person listed as a recipient. :eek: I didn't know she had married and taken a new last name. I'm fairly certain I can't be traced that way, but I'm not going to post that version of the name anywhere. She's an author too, writing under what I think is her real name.
     
    #8 Chloe, Mar 14, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2013
  9. SaleGayGuy

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    Hi all

    Just for clarification Sale is not my name its where I live.

    Sale Gay Guy
     
  10. tulman

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    SaleGayGuy,
    Thanks for posting this valuable information. I have already taken many of the precautions mentioned here but this is a good reminder not to get careless. It's not a wife I worry about, she's so asexual that she couldn't care less what I do or with who. It's the rest of the family, friends, business and local community that concern me. We never know who's reading this stuff and little details carelessly revealed could be read by those familiar with us and provide puzzle pieces to our identity. That could be very serious. I'm going to re-evaluate myself and probably not be as open as I have been. Thanks again for the slap upside the head.
     
  11. greatwhale

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    I have divulged a great deal of information to EC, but it is anonymized and the avatar and username are sufficiently hidden. As someone who deals with patient confidentiality I am aware of the pitfalls and know how to play it safe. Indeed, as BudderMC indicated above doing a very specific search with both Username and EC probably means you have found out about this affiliation by other means (my search history is set to be erased automatically, for example).

    There have been some very interesting developments with regard to privacy, with Facebook etc. there seems to be a great opening of personal information, so much so that the point is almost becoming moot, privacy is not what it used to be.

    The objective for me, in any case is to no longer worry about others finding out that I am gay, simply because I want it to be known, to all, eventually.
     
  12. SaleGayGuy

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    I too long for that day when I won’t have to worry or care who knows, but for now I just need to be careful.
     
  13. tulman

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    I wish it were that simple for me, as meaningless as what make of car I drive, but it's not. I'll continue to be as vague as possible. Probably even step it up some after this thread reminded me of how our every word can become a puzzle piece. For example, my current avatar is the picture of a TV show character. Those who know me are aware I watch that show. How many other puzzle pieces have I revealed that may lead to exposure? I frequent other forum based sites that discuss a wide variety of topics. True, it's fun and informative but maybe not too smart either. As the saying goes, "Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean nobody is watching you."
     
  14. Chip

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    Guys, I'm a pretty strong privacy advocate. That said, there comes a point where you need to just relax and take a breath.

    If you follow EC's security protocols, which means choosing a username that you do not use anywhere else on the Net, not posting any pics in the public forums, using a generic avatar, avoiding mention of your specific school or employer, and city/town if it's tiny, and not using your full name anywhere in the public forums... then there is virtually no way that anyone can connect your posts to you. All of these are part of our security protocol, which is as strict as it is specifically to keep people safe.

    When one is closeted, one lives a life of paranoia and fear, and most of the time the fear is grossly exaggerated. For example, even if you lived in a tiny town, or were in an unusual line of business... Google searching is keyword based. So without keywords such as the name of your company, your name, your city, and so forth... no one's going to be able to find what you've written here. Yes, it's out there, and yes, Google indexes posts that you write. But it indexes it using the text you've written. Google has no way of tracking the IP address of the poster, what part of the world a given post is posted from, or anything else that could identify you.

    So even if someone Googles your name, city, occupation, common usernames you use on other sites, and every other conceivable combination, he or she will not see any content from EC showing up in the search results because, quite simply, there's none of that personally-identifiable information anywhere in the EC content that Google is able to spider through, so nothing to match what you've written with who you are in real life.

    Even if you post on 100 different forums... as long as your posts here are using a unique username, and you don't use unusual words, phrases, or keywords that you also use on other forums where more of your user information is available... no one will find you.

    The only possible way someone is going to come across an EC post you've made and be able to associate it with who you are in real life is if they somehow already know your EC username (which means you've violated our security policy by using it elsewhere, or they've found it from snooping through your computer) or there's something else in your posts that is so unique that it will show up in search results that are looking at, literally, billiions of pages of text. It's a needle in a haystack, folks.

    I get the paranoia, and I remember having similarly ridiculously paranoid thoughts when I was closeted. But -- assuming you follow the policies that EC has set in place specifically to ensure you're safe here -- those fears are irrational, so take a moment, breathe, and let go of them. :slight_smile:
     
  15. tulman

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    I've complied with all of the protocol you mention and it's not that sort of tracking that concerns me so much. As I said before, it's the stuff we inadvertently do ourselves. The little puzzle pieces we leave that someone who knows us could stumble on and think, "Hmm, that sounds like it could be....." If we're not careful, we can be our own worst enemies.
     
  16. Chloe

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    Chip makes good points. I'm extra careful because I try to be visible as an author and therefore need to avoid making the wrong connections. For the typical member, posting on a forum with the basic precautions in mind is not going to expose anyone.
     
  17. Al123

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    The above privacy concerns reveal that life in the closet is not where you need to be.
    I came out to my wife two months ago. the relief and weight that is off my shoulders considerable. It was one of the most difficult conversations I have ever initiated.
    We are still talking and pondering what the future may hold.
    I got her in touch with the straight spouse network and she is also in touch with Bonnie Kaye, author of "Over the Cliff". Our wives need support just as we need support from EC members.
     
  18. Dalmatian

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    There is such a thing as worrying too much. Yes, Google indexes everything here, not because Google chose to, but because EC is saying "hey, Google, please come and read everything public". That's a normal thing, that's how sites advertise. Just as an info for those who might want to know, here's the robots.txt file of EC. It says to all robots to not index member info pages. Everything else is allowed (i.e. everything which is public, private stuff is private no matter the robots.txt).

    But the fact is, if you are really paranoid, there is nothing you can realistically do to be completely safe. For example, given any text you write, it is likely that a person who knows you well could recognize your style. But that's just too paranoid.

    The thing is, if I now wrote my full name here in this post (which I won't, it's not allowed :slight_smile:), that would most likely not result anytime soon in me being outed. And my name-surname combination is unique.

    And anyway.. just from the info on me here to the left <--, it is clear where I live (the city is under a million), which region I'm coming from (let's say there are tens of thousands in this city) and my age (which is maybe a few percents of all) and my gender (which halves the number). So, just by using that simple info, I'm not one of seven billion but one of maybe a few hundreds. With a few extra details from my posts, I'm easily pinpointed by anyone who knows me.

    I did a quick check.. if you search for "closeted gay dalmatia", which anyone might do, for example, closeted gay tourists who come to Dalmatia, which is a touristically very active region, the first result on google.com is my post here. And in that very post, I'm writing about relatively specific things that people who know me would immediately link to me.
    So, am I worried? No, because I think an incredible succession of events should occur for someone to actually find out about me.
    And just to point out, while I now no longer would mind (that much) the fact of being outed to someone, I would still mind if someone who knew me read my posts here knowing it was me. It's just that there are insecurities, worries, personal stuff, emotions.. which are revealed here thanks to anonymity.
     
    #18 Dalmatian, Mar 16, 2013
    Last edited: Mar 16, 2013
  19. RainbowMan

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    Interestingly, I use Chrome incognito to go on EC. I just did a search on Google for "my name" gay, and found something - including a picture. It's my Meetup profile! I'm in an LGBT meetup group around here, and I never thought about anonymity there, since I joined years ago and had no LGBT meetups or anything of the sort. I made my group memberships and interests private, but still show up in the content of this one group.

    Not a huge deal, again - people would have to come across those very specific search terms, and if they did, I'm outed anyhow. Am I even the least bit concerned? Maybe a tiny bit, but I'm not going to lose any sleep tonight over it.

    My posts here are very distinctively me, and I've revealed probably enough that people could figure out who I was if they tried hard enough looking through my 400+ posts. Again, not concerned. As Chip points out, there comes a point when you need to relax and take a breath.
     
  20. Ianthe

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    The thing is, anyone who "stumbles on" any of your posts on Empty Closets, would have to be reading and posting on Empty Closets themselves.

    It's like what we tell people when they go into gay places for the first time and they say "But what if someone sees me?"

    In order for someone to see you in a gay bar, that person would have to be at the gay bar, too. And to tell anyone they saw you, they would have to explain what they were doing there.

    Do you know a whole lot of people who would be likely to be willing to explain what they were doing on a support website for gay people, in order to expose you?