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Having issues with my Son

Discussion in 'For Parents and Family Members of LGBT People' started by MumWithAGayKid, May 1, 2014.

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  1. MumWithAGayKid

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    Hello Empty Closets forum.

    I hope everyone is doing well.

    I don't really know where else I can go for this advice and I feel like I'm in way over my head at this point. I don’t even really know where to start with this but I hope another parent who reads this can offer some guidance on how to best deal with my son. I really don’t want him to hate me, but I also need to be a parent and set boundaries on what is and isn’t acceptable behaviour.

    He recently came out to me as gay after I asked him about it and I’m trying to cope with everything. I’m definitely not happy that he thinks he is gay but I want to support him the best I can. There are worst things he could have thrown at me, but I honestly have no idea how to deal with a gay child and he and I have not been getting along since then. I realize that he’s a hormonal teenager but I feel like he hates me and as a mum it’s the worst feeling in the world to have your child scream and call you horrible names, or simply refuse to talk to me like he’s now doing 90% of the time.

    I know I haven’t fully accepted that he’s gay yet but I’m hoping he decides he likes girls again since he’s dated some in the past year and was happy. I really don’t have an issue with him being gay if he is, but I just hope he isn’t since that would be for the best. It may be selfish of me, but I know he would be much happier with a girl in the end since he could have a normal life. He isn’t camp at all and it still confuses me over why he started being attracted to his mates. Him and his girlfriend were so cute with each other and he seemed so happy when he was dating her so I don’t understand the sudden switch.

    I’m mainly having an issue with him having sex with a neighbour’s kid. He’s admitted to it several times now after he been caught, and I know he’ll do it again if I give him any opportunity to be alone with him. I personally think he’s too young to have sex. I made the mistake in giving him a few condoms since I didn’t want him to get AIDs if he made a poor decision and he took that as a sign to go have sex freely. That was not what I intended at all. I’ve also tried talking to him about how it’s not a good idea to be the girl in the relationship since it isn’t healthy but he refuses to talk about it.

    I really don’t know what to do about this other than limit his opportunities. I’m currently making him come directly to my workplace after he finishes school for the day. I know he’s bored but he does his homework which isn’t the worst thing. He isn’t happy about it though and says its embarrassing. Some evenings I coach gymnastics after work and I feel bad that he’s stuck there for a couple of hours, but I honestly don’t trust him to behave without supervision and he’s too old for a babysitter.

    I’ve been trying my best to block gay websites through our parental controls on his PC. I don’t know if he doesn’t realize that I can see the websites that he tries to visit but I am really upset at the content and purpose for some of the sites. I don’t know if I should bring it up to him or not since they are technically being blocked, and I don’t want him to know I can see the list since it’s a good way to keep up to date with what he’s doing. It just worries me over some of the things he has searched for.

    I also sat him down and made him go through his mobile with me and I was extremely upset and disappointed at what he was doing on that, as well. He had several applications installed that were sending everyone his location to strangers for the purposes of having sex. He said he didn’t meet anyone from there and was just curious but I don’t know if he was lying since there were some active conversations where guys were trying to solicit favours from him.

    I was also very upset over his texts with his mate. They were extremely sexual and they had sent each other some "cheeky" photos. I know he was embarrassed for me to see them, and as a mum I felt bad when he started crying and asking me to delete them, but I hope he felt enough shame not to do it again and know that it was a stupid thing to do.

    I know he hates me for this but I formatted his iPhone and enabled restrictions so that he cannot use the camera, video chat, install applications without me approving them, see adult content in the web browser, or use the GPS. He has complained that his mobile is useless now and that I'm being entirely unfair but I think I only disabled things he could use inappropriately. Am I being unreasonable here? It thought it was better than completely taking away his mobile. I just want to protect him though he obviously doesn’t see it like that. Is there some method that I don't know about where he can get around my restrictions I set up?

    Overall I would appreciate some advice on how to rein him in. Is there a good way to curb his sexual impulses so that he can focus on better things until he's older? I think the biggest issue right now is that I don’t trust him at all as he keeps lying about nearly everything. I just don’t know how to mend things and get rid of his current hostility towards me.
     
  2. Chip

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    Hi, and welcome to EC. You're definitely in the right place, and I know this has got to be really difficult for you, so I'll do my best to offer some suggestions that might be helpful.

    The first piece of information that would be really helpful to know is how old he is. Approprlate behavior for a 13 year old is completely different than appropriate behavior for a 16 or 17 year old.

    Putting the age-appropriate issues aside, first, it is very, very likely that he's gay and isn't going to change. Most teens who are questioning don't come out to parents (and don't start having sex) until they're pretty certain where their orientation lies. Also, there are many, many gay guys who had girlfriends, and here at EC, we have quite a few that got married, knowing full well they were gay... and now, in the middle of their lives, they're trying to be who they truly are. Many others commit suicide because they can't handle living the lie.

    So as much as you may not want to hear it, it's much better off for him that he knows now rather than try to fool himself and be someone he's not.

    Another piece for you to know, for yourself, is that any time anyone goes through any sort of loss -- in this case, loss of perception your son is straight -- there are stages in processing that loss: denial-anger-bargaining-grief-acceptance. It sounds like you could be somewhere between the anger and bargaining stages (accepting that he's gay, or acting out gay, and hoping he'll still end up with a girl is classic bargaining.)

    As far as trying to restrict his behavior... you may be able to format his phone, kill all his conversations, erase his porn, and block access to porn and hookup sites... but that won't make him straight, won't keep him from hooking up, and won't keep him from looking at porn, being who he is, or finding other ways to do what he wants to do. I'm not saying that you shouldn't be doing what you're doing, particularly if he's at the younger end of his teen years, but even in the early teen years, teens are already started to develop independence, and attempts on the part of the parent to impose drastic restrictions usually backfire, create resentment, and simply drive the behavior underground.

    If I were in your position, I'd try to have an honest, heartfelt conversation with him. That won't be easy, as you've already sort of shown your hand and made it clear that you don't approve of his "decision." So that most likely means first coming to terms with who he is yourself, and, as hard as it may be, learning to fully love and embrace who he is, whether that's gay, straight, or somewhere in between. And learning to not have any agenda or desire as to what that ultimate outcome is, because, honestly, neither you nor he can change it.

    Once you're able to sit with yourself and fully embrace who he is, then you need to have a long conversation with him about trust, integrity, the importance of openness and transparency, and you need to walk your talk.

    The truth is, if he wants to have sex, unless you can honestly reach him where his mind is, and help him understand why it's a bad idea (and if he's beyond 15 or so, that's going to be a real stretch), he's not going to listen to you, and it is likely better for you to cultivate acceptance and transparency with him than to continue to take a "don't do it" approach, because that's just going to encourage him to figure out a way to use one of the hookup apps and start hooking up with, likely, older/creepy guys. You're a lot better off with him feeling able to talk to you and be open with you.

    This isn't easy territory, and I know that none of the above are what you want to hear. But what your son needs more than anything is a parent he can love and trust, one who he knows will love, accept, and trust him for who he is. Because he's starting to individuate (a normal process for teens), if he feels that he can trust you and be open with you, he's a lot more likely to listen to what you have to say than if you put up a wall and set non-negotiable boundaries. And at this point, maintaining connection with him is what he needs, what's best for him, and the best possible outcome.
     
  3. MumWithAGayKid

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    Hi Chip. He is 14. I know he visits this site due to the parental controls so I don't want to go into too much detail where he notices the post and no longer feels comfortable visiting this site. Is there a parent-based forum similar to this to get advice? I had originally looked into PFLAG but I didn't like their tone.
     
    #3 MumWithAGayKid, May 1, 2014
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  4. Jethro702

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    Well, I don't think I could've said that any better than Chip already has.

    Anyways, When I first started becoming sexually attracted to boys (around the same age as him) I did some of the things he has done.... I messaged other males on those app and websites, I never did actually have sex though *I was and still not comfortable with being out to people in real life*, As I grew older these things didn't mean as much anymore and quite honestly I get disgusted now if someone tries to do it with me anymore.

    I agree a calm, heart to heart convo should make some things better. Acceptance is key for him at this point as he probably is still coming to terms with this himself. Maybe mention the dangers of sex and doing at such a young age to him? Just try to stay calm and level headed, then maybe he will too. I know these must be trying times for you but you have come to a great place for advice and help through these situations. :slight_smile:
     
  5. Clay

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    From what you've said, though you probably wont like to hear this, I think the problem for a lot of these situations is you, not him.

    I'm going to go off a hunch and say that you live in the UK, in which case your son will be able to have sex legally in under 2 years anyway. While 14 is young, this is the age where you need to relax on being so controlling as a mother. You've gone to the stage where you've invaded his privacy and broken his trust to the extent that it reduced him to tears. You also seem to be doing this mainly because you don't want him to be gay, rather than for his own benefit. For example, you seemed to like him when he had a girlfriend, but it's highly likely that, were he straight and with her, they'd also be having sex.

    The first thing you need to do is stop hoping that'll he "turn" back straight. If he knows and has accepted he's gay at 14 then he's gay, that wont change. Ultimately it is selfish to expect that, and I think it's clouding your judgement.

    As with having sex with the neighbours kids, they're both underage but consenting, so they're at that awkward stage where no one really knows what to do. You can try your best to stop them from having sex which is fine, but it probably wont work. The best thing I can say in this situation is you don't have to worry about him getting AIDS from his boyfriend, that's not going to happen even if they don't have safe sex, but I'd still stress to him that if he's going to have sex make sure it's safe sex. That's all anyone can really do in this situation. As for not being the "girl" in the relationship (the correct term is "bottom") because you think it's unhealthy, there's again nothing that you can do there. It's also not unhealthy, there's just a societal stigma attatched to things like that which are ultimately meaningless. It seems your son understands that.

    As for his phone, you could block adult content and installing new applications, but the rest you're just being a bit too overprotective about. By mortifying him by going through his phone and reducing him to tears you've probably not achieved what you hoped, which is showing him those sort of things are embarrassing, instead you've probably just shown him that you can't be trusted.

    And this is the most important part: Trust.

    An open relationship between you is far more important than a relationship where you consistently show him you can't trust him. You're teaching him that you can't be trusted, that if he has a problem he can't come to you with it. That's not a healthy relationship for a mother and son to have. My mum broke my trust many times when I was around his age and all these years later I still don't trust her. If you continue to show him that you can't be trusted, then you really risk losing an open relationship with your son.

    If you want him to trust you, if you want to mend things, you're probably going to have to reign in the controlling behaviour a bit and accept that he's gay and it wont be changing.
     
    #5 Clay, May 1, 2014
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  6. Best of Both

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    I agree
     
  7. Chip

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    Well... 14 is tough. While I fundamentally agree with you that having sex at 14, and particularly considering hooking up with people at 14 is really, really unwise, one of the things that the admin team here has been discussing is the changing face of younger teens' awareness of sex and sexual behavior. I've noticed a pretty profound difference just since 2008 when I started volunteering for EC.

    Many 14 year olds today are very sex-literate; one study indicates that up to 40% of all kids have seen pornography by age 8, thanks to the Internet. That, in turn, creates increasing awareness of one's sexuality and may create an earlier interest in sexual activity than would otherwise have occurred. It seems pretty clear that's what's going on for your son, and depending on his demeanor and his relationship with you, he may be in the "I know everything and don't need your advice" stage, which is challenging in any case, but even more so for a 14 year old who is sexually active.

    So while I agree that finding a way to discourage sexual activity would be a good thing for a variety of reasons, I suspect, realistically, that the only real option is to try to cultivate a really open, honest, and nonjudgmental relationship. That's going to be tough given the restrictions and walls you've already put up.

    I'm not saying you did something bad, or made a wrong decision here; without the knowledge I have now, my first instincts would be the same. I'm just basically being realistic that at this stage, I think the most important thing is to try and regain trust, and position your relationship with him is one where you can give him suggestions, input, and advice, and hope that he listens, because I think the attempt to impose firm boundaries is going to have limited, if any, success, and the result will be his doing what he wants, without telling you, without listening to your input... which won't serve his best interests.

    Talking about sex to one's teen-aged child is generally a mortifying experience for both parent and child. For most of us (parents and children), there's a lot of embarrassment and shame surrounding issues of sex and sexuality. But in this circumstance, the best thing, I think, is to try and push past the shame and embarrassment (yours, at least) and try and cultivate an honest, nonjudgmental conversation. It may take some time with you modeling openness, vulnerability, and non-judgment (the hardest part) for him to be able to feel a sense of trust, but if you are able to do that, I think that he will eventually come around and feel more comfortable reaching out to you.

    In that regard, you may have to let go of the idea you can stop him from having sex. But what you may be able to do is talk honestly about what sex is, and how good sex is way more than physical stimulation and orgasm, and that if he can be encouraged to wait, and be more thoughtful about whom and when and how often he chooses to have sexual experiences, that the experiences he has will be more meaningful and rich. That's a bit of a tough concept to get across to many teens, but if it's spoken with openness and vulnerability, many teens are surprisingly open to hearing it.

    Again, I want to be clear I don't disagree with any of your viewpoints, or even your decisions up to this point; I'm just saying that I think if the end goal is helping your son to make smart decisions and to be healthy in his sexual experiences, what I'm suggesting above is probably the only really viable route.

    It's also, for the most part, the common discourse you see discussed here at EC, so his continuing to post and discuss things here -- and, as difficult as it might be, giving him the privacy to talk about what he wants to without snooping on his postings -- will likely be a very positive experience for him and perhaps to help him to hear the right messages from his peers and others that have had some of the same experiences he's having.

    As far as other communities for parents, other than PFLAG, I'm not aware of any. EC is a pretty unique place, and the creation of the forum for parents and family members is relatively new for us (within the past year) but it's been growing pretty significantly. I think you'll find, if you continue to post, that there are others in your position with whom you can share experiences and support one another, and many of our members who are teens and young adults have pretty deep insights that can help parents as well.

    Our staff is also available for individual PM support and communication if there are issues you want to discuss outside of the public forums.
     
  8. Andrew99

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    Ok now I just wanted to let u know if your son doesn't end up liking girls which is a 50/50 possibility. Your going to have to learn to accept him. And y is that? Bc ur a mom and moms will stick by there child every single way bc that's what a good mom does. It's ok if your not thrilled about it I don't think any parent ever is but what u can do is u can learn to accept him one step at a time. I know u still love him and I hope to god u won't disown him bc that's the worst thing u can do. The best thing u can do is go up to his room talk to him and say even though I can't accept this now but I will try to I will still always love u. He really could use that bc it's hard to be a young gay teen. Believe me I would know.
     
  9. KyleD

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    At 14 he is way too young to be having sex. I think he's just acting up to get your attention.

    Both of you need to meet each other half way.
     
  10. Clay

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    I disagree. You don't do these sort of things to get the attention of your mum.
     
  11. KyleD

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    Why do you think he is acting that way?
     
  12. Kat 5

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    He's a teenager. Teenagers are rebels. I should know. I am one.
     
  13. Kasey

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    I deal with 120 of them each day... Teenagers rebel and try to resist authority.

    A teenager who is not feeling supported is going to lash out for attention or do what makes them feel best.
     
  14. AwesomGaytheist

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    It's not hard to see why. You've been trying to change him to straight. I've said this to a bunch of parents on this site, that the things you say and do right after they come out to you, they're going to remember and it's going to affect them for the rest of their lives. Here's another quote that explains why he's probably feeling this way:

    A normal life? I'm gay and in a relationship and live a normal life. Just because he likes guys doesn't mean he's never going to get married, have a family, go to college, buy a house, all the things that straight people do. I'm a 19-year-old college student, studying to be an airline pilot. Do I not live a "normal life" just because I like guys? Being gay isn't a disease. It's not a disorder. Gay people come from all walks of life, we work every type of job, we live in every city and town.

    Here's why: He was gay the whole time. I don't know if he was with a girl as a cover because he was scared to come out (Which was what my aunt did for the longest time to hide being a lesbian from her family), but that could be the case. I thought I was straight for the longest time before I realized I liked men at age 14-the same age as your son is now. While I never had a girlfriend, it's possible that having a girlfriend caused him to realize that he's not into girls. He doesn't have to be "camp" to be gay. I don't fit the stereotypical gay guy at all, and guess what: I'm gay.

    He's not "going and having sex freely." You told me he was only having sex with one guy. If they're the same age, that's normal and to be expected, and it's good that he's only having sex with one person. While yes, 14 is young, it's good that he knows to use protection, and you've got to admit, you've got a smarter-than-average son.

    Don't ever say something like that, "being the girl." There's no girl involved: only two guys. That's why it's called a gay relationship. And there's nothing unhealthy about bottoming either. Why do you think he shut down? You called him a girl and told him that a normal human sexual activity is "unhealthy" and demanded that he change his attractions which he can't control. This is like biting the hand that feeds you and wondering why you're starving to death.

    Well of course you didn't, they didn't tell you what you wanted to hear.

    You're overreacting. He's becoming an adult and you can't control him forever. You do have a point about the apps, and no he shouldn't be on there, but to make him go to work with you and all that...well he isn't a little boy anymore. You have to let him live his life and make sure he knows how to be safe. You can't live his life for him.

    So he's not as immature as you say he is.

    Adult content isn't as big a deal as the dating sites are, but you're still being unreasonable. GPS tracking is so over the top.

    The short answer: you can't. He's at that age where it's normal to have strong sexual urges, and if he's going to have sex, it's better that he know how to have safe sex. I don't blame him at all for lying to you about this stuff, as you've shown nothing but hostility, anger, disapproval, and done nothing but make rash, knee-jerk decisions. The damage you've done is self-inflicted, and if you're willing to stop all the drama, stop all the self-pity "Woe as me" stuff over having a gay son, and calm down and approach this with a cool head, maybe you can try having an honest dialogue. If you do the same thing, you're going to get the same results, and that's only going to make it worse. You need some help in dealing with this, and I suggest a therapist.

    Let me end this response the way it began. The decisions you make and the things you say now, will affect him for the rest of his life. He will live with this memory until the day he dies. How do you want him to look back on it? You can be like my boyfriend's mother who took it like you did at first (though not as extreme) and eventually came around and embraced her son just the way he is. Or you can keep doing what you've been doing and things are only going to get worse and he might end up resenting you for a very long time. The ball's in your court.
     
    #14 AwesomGaytheist, May 1, 2014
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  15. homoblomo

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    First of all you don't decide to like girls or boys, I didn't decide to like boys, I just do, I was born this way. all you have to do is love him, it doesn't matter whom he loves, I mean if you have other kids, do you love them solely because they are straight. If parents loved their kids for that sole reason that would be fucked up.
    To answer another of your questions, it is selfish of you to think he would be happier dating girls, being hetero doesn't signify having a normal life. what is normal to you, being miserable for the rest of your life, living a lie just so that those around you will be happy no matter how self destructive it is to yourself. a normal life where you live a façade of what should, longing for something else until the day you die, that is what it would be like for him if he hides his true self. if you love him like you say you do, I know that his happiness would make you happy, whatever his happiness would be.

    deuces. :eusa_clap
     
  16. Pret Allez

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    I agree with Chip in that I think the most successful approach would be for you to have an open, honest, and loving conversation with your son. In my view, the content of that conversation should include you stating that you're okay with him being gay, that you're an ally, and he can come to you if he needs help with any marginalization or peer abuse he's suffering in school. You should say that you'd like him to stay safe and abstain from sexual activity for at least a year (preferably two), but ultimately, you want him to be safe even if he doesn't always make the best choices. You can teach him about internet safety at this time.

    However, were I you, I would cease these surveillance and controlling activities that are humiliating him. These are behaviors which are going to prevent him from listening to things he needs to hear, because he's going to view you as a person who debases and emasculates him, when you need for him to see you as a loving, understanding person who corrects his missteps.

    Right now, your whole posture causes him to distrust you. Your comment about it not being healthy for him to "be the girl" in a relationship was very problematic and offensive, and that alone probably makes it almost impossible for you to talk to him about these issues. I think perhaps a specific apology about this comment and a reconciliation over the surveillance would foster a good dialogue and make him more receptive to specific lessons that he could in fact benefit from.

    Compassionate Regards,

    Adrian
     
    #16 Pret Allez, May 1, 2014
    Last edited: May 1, 2014
  17. Fallingdown7

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    Agree with awesomgaytheist on this one...

    I do understand some of your concerns, like the sex and app thing at his age. But trying to make him feel ashamed of what he's been doing is the wrong way to go. I think you need to have a talk about sex that is open and honest where he can trust you to go to you about his concerns and learn more about safe sex.

    To be honest, I feel like teens are far more likely to engage in risky sexual behavior when their parents try to hide sex from them. Pretty much every teen (Except a select minority) have strong sexual urges. I was there at one point, but I could talk to my mom about sex comfortably, and because of that I never became sexually active. However, since he is sexually active now, it needs to be discussed.

    He's gay and that won't change, so I think the first thing to do is accept him as he is. I do agree with Chip on the bargaining thing though, and it might take you a while to fully come to terms with it. That's completely fine! However, try not to make any statements that could make him feel like his sexuality is attacked or that heterosexuality is more valid, since I assure you that it will affect him for the rest of his life.

    If you're gay, you can never live a happier or normal life with a woman (Or with a man in the case of lesbians) because that's called living a lie. Sure, he could end up with a woman in the future, but it wouldn't make him have a happy life. He would be lying to himself and it would completely hurt his wife in the process.

    Being a gay man does have some societal disadvantages, because people don't accept you and might even physically harm you. But It's still better to accept who you are. The suicide rates are higher in LGBT folk that can't come to terms with it and force themselves to be straight/cis.

    One last thing, the whole "being the girl" thing was probably why he refused to talk about sex, because he must have been taken aback by that comment (especially when it was mixed with the unhealthy statement).

    There is no "girl role" in a gay relationship. There are a lot of men (even straight ones) who like being penetrated, but it doesn't make them a girl, and I find it kind of insulting to imply that. As for bottoming being "unhealthy"; well, anal sex does have a higher STD risk, but that's why you need to talk about safe sex and being careful about who you choose to sleep with. I mean, technically, traditional heterosexual intercourse is pretty "unhealthy" for the same reasons; since it also has a high STD risk. It's all about knowing the risks and protecting yourself.

    I hope you are able to talk to him.
     
  18. starfish

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    Let's be sure not to beat up on the OP. She needs our support just as much as her son.


    I'm curious what you didn't like? When I first came out, I was very uncomfortable with the gay groups I first checked out. I eventually realized that it was my internalized homophobia that made me uncomfortable.

    I can understand your reaction to finding out that he is having sex. I have a sister who is 16. A couple of years ago she made a comment about oral sex that I could believe she that. My mind instantly went to the worst possible place. I've talked to her about sex and she has told me she is a virgin, but frankly I don't believe her. I have to say it makes me uneasy, and I want to beat up any boy that gets near her.

    Though I have to realize that too is my problem. I still see her as this little 5 year old girl, who needs her big brother to watch out for her. It is tough to think of her growing up and becoming sexual. She is a smart kid, and if I step back and look objectively the guys she has dated have been pretty good guys. All I can do is worry and trust that she makes good decisions.

    My opinion is that you need to rebuild some of the trust that you lost with your son. You should ease up on the reins a bit. I think a good start would be to let him start seeing the neighbor kid again. At that age relationships only last a few weeks anyway. So let them spend some time together and it sort its self out. Once he feels free to look for a relationship among his peer group, he'll have less desire to use the gay dating apps.
     
  19. Aldrick

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    I largely agree with most of what others wrote.

    I'm going to be honest with you. You're in a tough position, and you're trying to move forward with a severe trust deficit. That's something that needs to be mended as quickly as possible, because without it you're not going to be able to have any honest and open conversations with him.

    I won't spend time looking backward saying what you could have done differently to be in a better position. You are where you are right now, there is no going back. We can only move forward.

    The biggest obstacle you face is coming to terms with the fact your son is gay. If he said he's gay, then he's gay. Period. He can't change it. You can't change it. Taking actions that you think may influence his sexual orientation won't change it, and it will only backfire horribly. This may not have been news that you wanted to hear, but our lives are filled with unpleasant news that we didn't want to hear. We deal with that news as best we can, we accept it as reality, and we move forward. That's all we can do, because life is filled with things that we have absolutely no control over. Sexual orientation is one such thing.

    Moving forward, the first question you should ask yourself is this: "If my son was straight, and all things about the situation were equal, how would I handle this situation?"

    If what you're about to do would be handled the same if he were straight, then you're probably on the right path. If what you're about to do would be handled DIFFERENTLY if he were straight, then nine times out of ten you're probably heading down the wrong path.

    For example... does he have any older siblings? Have you ever checked their devices for pornographic material? Have you ever forced them to sit down with you as you read their private conversations with their boyfriend / girlfriend, and forced them to view nude / explicit photos they'd taken of themselves? If you found out they were having sex, would you react in the same way? If the answer to any of these questions is no, then you should question yourself as to why you're treating your gay son differently than his straight siblings.

    Doing this is a good way to detect whether or not you're running off the rails, so long as you're being honest with yourself.

    One of the big problems you have right now is that you're creating a situation where you're going to end up forcing your son into situations where he has to outsmart you. Sooner or later, he's going to find a way to circumvent you, most likely by turning to people outside of your influence. That can be potentially dangerous, depending on where he turns.

    A great example is him being on the apps you mentioned. For a young teenager his age that's dangerous. In fact, I'm pretty sure he had to lie about his age to even be able to log on to it, since they're intended for adult use. (Or those above the age of consent, which may vary by country - here in the United States it's eighteen.)

    Your instinct to prevent his access to those apps was a good one. For example, if he had an older brother, you wouldn't (I hope) feel comfortable with him hooking up with older adult women. Especially older adult women who are most likely interested in having sex with him.

    One of the important reasons you want to rebuild the trust deficit between you both, is so that he won't do things like this - he'll be able to remain within your sphere of influence, and you can guide him away from dangerous behaviors. And it's not really hard to explain to a teenager of his age, I'm pretty sure he realizes that meeting up with an older guy whose interested in sex probably isn't the best idea - even if his intent isn't to have sex.

    You're in a difficult position. For most teenagers, these years are some of the most difficult. It's a balancing act because they aren't quite adults, and they're not quite children. It's a struggle to figure out how much trust, responsibility, and freedom you can give them, based on how mature enough they are to handle that trust, responsibility, and freedom. It can be a struggle under the best circumstances.

    Once again, the best thing you can do is to ask yourself whether you'd do or say what you were doing or saying if your son was straight and all other things were equal. If the answer to that is an honest yes, then you're probably heading on the right track, and if the answer is no you're probably on the wrong track.

    Raising a gay child isn't really any different than raising a straight child. Where there are significant differences it has nothing to do with them, and everything to do with the people around them and the culture as a whole. They may face challenges and difficulties that their straight counterparts might not face, but those challenges and difficulties weren't caused by them - they're caused by others.

    With all the above being said, I want to address some very specific things you wrote...

    Him being gay, bi, or straight isn't something that he gets to decide. It's not something that anyone gets to decide. That's just the reality of the situation. He is what he is, and trying to persuade him to be something different isn't going to work - it's going to backfire.

    As your son is gay, the fact that he was dating girls in the past is fairly irrelevant. There are lots of gay people who've had opposite sex relationships. There are even people on this forum who've entered into opposite sex marriages and had children. I'm pretty sure that virtually every single person on this forum who has been in that position would tell you pointedly, that it's not a position that they'd wish on your son. Especially since it seems he knows he is gay.

    Also, I want to point out that your son isn't too young to know whether or not he's gay or straight. While it's true that some people realize things later in life, a lot of people - myself included - knew that they were gay much younger than fourteen. People may not come to terms where they're able to accept themselves as gay until much later, but that is quite different from not knowing the truth.

    Let's be honest with ourselves here. The first part of that statement isn't true, because it's followed by a "but" - you do have an issue with him being gay. That's okay. You're entitled to feel the way that you feel. It's perfectly fine for you to say that you wish your son were straight. It won't make it true, but it's important to be honest with the way that you feel.

    As to knowing he'd be happier with a girl instead of a guy, considering the fact that he's gay, we both know that he wouldn't be happier - he'd end up miserable and likely in a failed marriage probably with kids thrown into the mix. Having seen things like this play out in real time, I can say that I know you don't wish that for your son. It's a horrible experience for everyone involved.

    As to a "normal life" - what is normal? I think if you were given a choice for your son to lead a life that everyone else approved of, and a life in which he was happy and honest with himself - you'd choose for him to be happy and honest. You'd want that because you love your son. It may not be an easier life, but sometimes life is hard and difficult. That's just the nature of it. What's important is that you're happy.

    From a parental perspective, it's normal to feel this way. Especially since it seems that you just got the news. You're still sorting everything out. However, I seriously doubt there was a "sudden switch" from his perspective. It's not as if you wake up one day and just decide to be gay. Often, it's something that you struggle to come to terms with for a long time before reaching acceptance and THEN telling other people. Some people reach that moment of acceptance sooner than others.

    Being camp isn't a mark of being gay. It's a stereotype. Most gay people aren't camp, and don't fit the stereotypes. Gay people come in all shapes, sizes, and forms. We're members of every race, religion, ethnic group, social status, economic status, nation, tribe, culture, hold power in virtually every occupation, and any other group or division that you can think of - we're members of that. As a result, there is no such thing as a "type" of gay person, because there are as many different "types" of gay people as there are people who are gay.

    First of all, you didn't make a mistake giving him condoms. That's a smart move on your part. You want to teach your son to have safe sex, especially if he's going to have sex regardless whether or not he has condoms. Let's be clear about that right now - you want to encourage good sexual behavior if he's engaging in sexual activity.

    If he's having sex with some other kid whose never had sex before, him getting HIV or some other STI likely isn't a serious risk. However, that doesn't mean you shouldn't still work insanely hard to instill safe sex practices into him.

    I completely understand you not wanting him to have sex at such a young age. However, I will go back to my earlier advice. If he were straight and all things being equal, how would you handle this situation?

    A lot of young teenagers begin to become sexually active around his age. The big issue here isn't so much their age, it's their lack of maturity and ability to make good decisions. With straight kids having sex, you not only have to worry about STI's, but pregnancy. So, on the bright side that's one thing you don't have to worry about when having a gay child. No unexpected pregnancies.

    When it comes to the sex, I'd handle it exactly how you handled it if they have older siblings. There is no need to create special exceptions and rules.

    And, of course, regardless of how you handle the sex situation, you're still going to want to encourage and promote safe and responsible behavior. You want to do this, even if they aren't having sex, because at some point in the future they will be having sex.

    First of all, there is no girl in a gay relationship. That's pretty much what defines a gay relationship between two guys - the lack of a female. Talking about it in those terms with him is an insult to his masculinity, as if somehow he's less than a man. That's just absolutely false.

    Second, I'm going to assume that you mean that he's engaging in anal sex as the bottom or passive partner. I want to be clear about something here. Culturally speaking, we have a tendency to view anal sex as an act between two men. This is false. Anal sex has no sexual orientation or gender attached to it. There are straight women who enjoy anal sex, there are lesbians who enjoy anal sex, there are straight men who enjoy anal sex from female partners using sex toys - pretty much every combination of individuals you can think of... and let me also be clear about something else. Anal sex is not a substitute for procreative sex between straight people - that is: penis inside a vagina.

    There is no intent or desire on the part of gay men to replicate procreative sex between a man and a woman. Looking at it through those terms is silly. People of all genders and sexual orientations engage in anal sex because it's enjoyable and pleasurable. There is also a lot of gay men who don't like anal sex.

    There is nothing inherently unhealthy about anal sex, so long as people are doing it properly and safely.

    Third, it's completely normal and expected that your son would not want to talk to you about his explicit sexual activities. It's even offensive to ask if he prefers to top or bottom. Let me try and put that in perspective. Imagine your are parents questioning you about your specific sexual acts with your boyfriend / husband / the men you're with. They want to know the intimate details of your sex life, what positions you prefer in bed, and whether or not you like it that way. Then they grow angry if you refuse to discuss it with them.

    As hard as it would be for you to discuss that with your parents, it's a hundred times worse for him. Since he's fourteen he's likely still struggling to come to terms with being gay. Talking about his very specific sex acts that he's engaged in with another guy, has not only the hurtle you'd face with discussing ANY sexual act with your parents, but the added difficulty that it's a sexual act with another guy. An act that you've already shown strong disapproval for in the past.

    I'm going to assume by "cheeky" you mean sexually explicit and nude photos. This is a big problem with teens this days - regardless of sexual orientation. I have to question whether or not you've ever done similar searches of the phones of any of his older siblings if he has any.

    What really bothers me about this situation here is that your goal here was to shame him. To quote you directly: "I hope he felt enough shame..." Really? Is that what you intended?

    There is a difference between talking about appropriate and inappropriate uses of the mobile phone, and I agree with you that his actions were inappropriate for someone of his age. However, there is a big difference between talking about inappropriate behavior and trying to shame and humiliate someone, which is - based on what you wrote - was your intended goal. After all, you made him cry, and said that you hope he felt shame for it.

    For me, personally, that's way off the rails. That's inappropriate behavior which I can't condone. There are very good and valid reasons to talk to him about sending inappropriate photos of himself to other people, as well as to prevent his access to the apps you mentioned.

    The number one reason that it's a bad idea for him to send racy photos of himself, is because once they're sent he has zero control over who sees them. This would be the real point I'd like to drive home, and there are plenty of examples of people having their phones hacked or their trust betrayed and their racy photos and videos ending up on the internet.

    Another reason, though I'm not sure if this is true in your country, but it's true here in the States - there have been situations where underage people have sent sexually explicit images of themselves to their boyfriends / girlfriends, and they've been arrested. They were arrested for trafficking in child porn. If this can happen in your country, then you really need to sit down and have that discussion with him.

    Another discussion I'd want to have with him, especially considering that he's fourteen, is the pressure he might receive to send sexually explicit photos and videos. I'd want to know if he felt comfortable doing it, and whether or not someone was pressuring him to do it. We'd have a discussion on consent and finding the courage to say no when you feel uncomfortable with doing something.

    Having discussions on consent is HUGELY important - as important as discussions on safe sex - with every teenager. Talking about what consent looks like, what it is and what it isn't, and how to say no in difficult circumstances where someone else wants you to say yes.

    These are all insanely important conversations to have with every teenager. This situation presented the opportunity to have that conversation. It would have been better to have these conversations, and telling him in no uncertain terms that doing these things isn't something you feel is acceptable due to his age. Then, it would have been better to use the threat of doing what you did as leverage to prevent him from doing it again. Basically, saying that if you do this again then I'm going to disable these features on your phone.

    As you can't go back in time and change what you've done, we need to figure out how to handle this moving forward. First, I'd straight up apologize to him for shaming and humiliating him. I'd make it clear that I handled it poorly.

    Next, I'd have the above conversations with him. Then, at the end, I'd make it clear that I am going to re-instate his phone to it's previous settings, PROVIDED that he promises to act with responsibility. If he's willing to act with responsibility, then I would lend him the trust to act accordingly. At some point in the future, I'd sit down with him again, and we'd go through the phone together.

    However, this time I would specifically ask him point blank, if I was going to find anything that he wouldn't want me to see. Namely, racy photos, videos, or text messages. If the answer to that is no, then well - you're about to find out if he's lying to you or not. So, if you end up stumbling upon something that was previously discussed then you know he lied to you. If he tells you yes, then you should give him the opportunity to delete them before you look at the phone. There is no reason that you'd need to see the images or messages explicitly, because he's old enough to understand what is appropriate and what isn't.

    This way the situation isn't about shame and humiliation. It's about conduct, and why you feel certain conduct is inappropriate. You can have a discussion about the conduct, rather than about what he explicitly sent or wrote.

    I think by back tracking here, you also open the door to future compliance. You need some way to re-establish trust with him. By admitting that you were wrong, having these conversations, and re-instating his phone you're creating a situation where he gets to prove himself trustworthy.

    It's very important that he can find situations where he can prove to you that he can be trusted. You have to create expectations for him to live up too, and help him understand why you hold those expectations of him.

    If you don't you're just going to be playing a game of whack-a-mole. Where you whack a negative behavior every time it pops up, but give him no real skin in the game - nothing to lose. After all, he already has your disapproval. That's clear. How much lower can he really go? If he has your approval, if he has your trust, then he has something to lose should he prove himself - through his conduct - to be too immature to handle the responsibility that you've given him.

    I want to answer this question directly. The answer is no. It's completely normal for a fourteen year old male to have sexual impulses. In fact, for most males around his age it's the primary and overriding impulse. There is no way to curb it without going against all of human nature.

    The best thing you can do - perhaps the only thing you can do - is to teach him responsibility.

    I would have a discussion with him about why I wouldn't want him having sex at such a young age. And let me be clear here - that conversation would have nothing to do with his sexual orientation. If he were straight and engaged in sexual activity with a girl, aside from the issue of pregnancy which obviously isn't an issue in his case, what would you say to him and why? If he has older siblings, what did you say to them?

    And it has to be more than it's inappropriate, that reason doesn't fly with rebellious teenagers. That's just code for "you should do it as often as you can because it'll piss off your mother". Being able to actually explain it to him will help him understand your reasoning. Even if he doesn't agree with your reasoning, at least he knows you have them. That in turn gives you a lot more flexibility in how you deal with him in the future.

    In short, in this situation, I'd want to teach him responsibility, and I'd more-or-less handle things exactly the way I handled his straight siblings if he has them.

    The above is something I want to address specifically. You say these are texts with his mate. Are they in a relationship? Is he his boyfriend?

    If so, then it's probably best that you refer to him as such rather than simply his friend.

    You may not be ready to accept that fact yet, and it may be a struggle for you. That's normal. However, as you had no issue with him dating girls and calling them his girlfriend, it's a sign of disrespect to call someone who (I'm assuming) is his boyfriend just a friend. It's an insult to the relationship, and it sets a bad precedent moving forward for him.

    Gay people often find our relationships downgraded when compared to our straight counterparts. As your son is gay, you don't want to contribute to that downgrading of his relationships. It's important for him to learn that his romantic relationships are valid in the eyes of others, and that he shouldn't tolerate people downgrading them.

    I'm not sure what tone they used that offended you, but I would strongly encourage you to reconsider. There is a lot being placed on your shoulders right now, and you would do well to surround yourself by people who understand what you're going through and who can support you.

    Your son is at a critical point in his life right now. He's depending on you to be there for him and to be the best mother that you can be. He may face challenges ahead that you're unprepared to deal with alone. Having people who are willing to stand behind you is critical.

    Another thing that is really important is that your son be exposed to positive gay role models and influences. This is something that is sorely lacking in the lives of most LGBT teens, primarily because so few people come out in their teen years, and because many who do face difficulty with their parents.

    Having examples that they can lead a "normal" life - as you put it previously - is very important. It's also important that he grow to accept himself, and one way to encourage that is for him to meet other people who've already done so. That will allow him to gain experience from people who've already walked a mile in his shoes, and understand what he's feeling and going through.

    If there is a PFLAG in your area, then there is probably also an LGBT Youth Group. I'd highly encourage you into looking into one, and enrolling him in any programs they offer. Even if it's only a support group it'll give him the chance to meet other LGBT teens his age. This will reduce any sense of social isolation that he might feel.

    Of course, there is also the side benefit (from your perspective) that the more comfortable he grows with himself, the more open and communicative with you he'll become. That gets the dialog going. With you attending PFLAG on the side, that also prepares you to begin accepting his sexuality and having that dialog when you're both ready to have it.

    In closing, I hope I haven't come off as sounding too harsh or critical. I simply wanted to be bluntly honest with you about your situation, and give you some of the best advice that I can give you moving forward. I may have said things that you may not have wanted to hear, especially right now, but I am confident that in the future you will eventually thank me for writing them.

    I understand that you're in a difficult place. Things are chaotic and you're struggling to find your footing. That's all the more reason to be as honest as we can, so that we can work to gain control over the situation. You are clearly a mother who loves her son, otherwise you wouldn't be here seeking advice.

    For you, on a personal level, I think the best advice I can give you right now is to dig deep and look for the courage and strength you'll need to turn things around and move them in a more positive and productive direction. That's going to be difficult to do emotionally, at least right now. However, it will become easier for you as you grow to accept your son as gay. Once you do that, things become much clearer and easier for you.
     
  20. Chip

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    ^^^ This times 1000.^^^

    A situation like this is going to bring up all sorts of emotions and a lot of them aren't coming out of a place of compassion and empathy, but a place of immediate, gut response.

    Every person in this thread has acted out when something triggers them. Let's please treat this parent with the kindness, compassion, and empathy that she deserves, and that her son deserves. :slight_smile:
     
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