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To stay in Edinburgh or move, in light of my gay 14 year old?

Discussion in 'For Parents and Family Members of LGBT People' started by Minny, Sep 5, 2016.

  1. Minny

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    Hi everyone,

    I wonder if you can advise? My 14 year old son has just come out to us and I'm so happy he has done that.

    My question is: we were intending to move to a small town (for lifestyle reasons - we don't have to move) in the next year but now that my son is gay, I am having second thoughts as Edinburgh has a very established gay community with lots of clubs, bars and a 'pink triangle' where gay people can be seen holding hands etc.

    We were thinking of moving to a spa town called Cheltenham and I googled ''being gay in Cheltenham" and was horrified to find that the only gay bar had closed plus a terrible story about a boy my son's age who had been bullied at school (the same school we were going to put my youngest son in - (my gay son is home-educated)) who had committed suicide due to homophobic bullying.

    I'm thinking ahead to my son's older teenage years and think now that Edinburgh might be a much better place to grow up gay - am I right?

    Any advice would be much appreciated! Thanks so much.
     
  2. blightedsight

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    Hi, Minny.

    My partner and Iive in the Forest of Dean, just on the otherside of Gloucester:slight_smile:
    I don't think you should put off your move because of the lack of gay bars. He's 14. He won't be going in them for a few years, by which time he might be off to university, or moving away for other reasons.
    However, if he stays, he has great, quick and cheap(ish) train links to Gloucester and Bristol, both of which have thriving nightlifes for young gay guys. From Bristol, he's also close to Cardiff. Sure it might seem like a lot of travel, but people do it around here all the time.

    Add to that, you have lots of local groups on Facebook, from gamers to book groups for gay people, locally, so he wouldn't exactly be cut off.

    Sure, my partner and I are both beyond the club/bar stage, being in our 20's and 30's, but trust me, locally there are ways to meet other gay people.

    Sadly, kids up and down the country, your sons age are bullied. Bullies happen in every school and don't need a reason to pick on someone.

    At the end of the day, though, you have to do what you think is right for the family, and if you think putting your plans on hold for years until your son has grown up and moved out, thats up to you, but I don't know if that would be a good reason to do it.
     
    #2 blightedsight, Sep 5, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2016
  3. Minny

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    Thanks so much blightedsight for your reply. That's brilliant to know. I think I might look at Bristol and I didn't know about Gloucester as I've never been. I just thought Cheltenham (I went to school there years ago) might be a bit stuffy and too 'straight.'

    My son is home-educated so doesn't have the bullying issue to deal with. I wonder though, how freely he should tell people he's gay? My view is to be circumspect until he's older because you don't know who you're telling and if they're homophobic or not. We've had a little talk about this (he only came out to me yesterday!) and I said that not telling people was in no way saying there was any shame attached, just a matter of protecting yourself against bullies/unpleasant attitudes while he was still young. And that when he got older, it would be a lot easier to be very open with people - do you think that's the right thing to have advised? He seemed to agree with me on that point.

    I might post this question to see what people think.

    Thanks again. :slight_smile:
     
    #3 Minny, Sep 5, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2016
  4. blightedsight

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    I can do no better than give you a link to gay glos. Maybe call them and have a chat with them as they have very specific knowledge of the area.

    GAY-GLOS 07903 472899 - Youth

    I hope it all works out. You definitely have a sensible approach and it would be a shame if you didn't down because you feel its not a supportive area.
    Before I moved here, I was concerned that it might be a little more conservative than I am used to, but so far, I've had no negative expetiences in regards to my sexuality in Gloucestershire.
    Feel free to ask any more questions, too...I know where the nice coffee shops are:slight_smile:
     
    #4 blightedsight, Sep 5, 2016
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  5. Robert

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    Can I just be critical for a moment?

    I dont want to be mean but it seems like you are coddling your son too much. I understand you're trying to protect him but doing things like advising him to stay in the closet could seriously damage his self-confidence - please dont let your own insecurities and fears damage your sons mental wellbeing.

    I know that it is your instinct to want to protect him from everything in the world but you have to let him make his own decisions and mistakes.
    He's old enough to judge for himself whether he should be in the closet or not and he doesnt need his mother holding him back.

    Sorry if that sounded too harsh but I really feel you made the wrong call and you should do all you can to reverse it.
     
  6. Minny

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    Thanks for the link blightedsight - that's fab.

    Hmm, Robert, that is a bit harsh. I'm certainly not telling my son to stay in the closet - why would I do that?

    I am saying he should tell people he trusts as he sees fit. What I am saying is common sense to me - though I'd be interested to hear others' opinions on this - that to complete strangers he might not want to broadcast he is gay at age just 14 in case he gets bullied. That's a matter of keeping his privacy.

    As for 'coddling' - I don't believe in 'tough love'. I just love my son and he will do what he wants anyway, I can only advise as I see fit: which is why I'm on here trying to get educated. Thanks anyway for your input.
     
  7. OnTheHighway

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    Putting aside the benefits of using bars and clubs to be social, where ever you live, you should consider what LGBT community groups are available. There are LGBT community groups for children, there are ones for adults. There are LGBT sport leagues and other social organizations that can go a long way in helping your son grow and mature as a proud gay individual. Do research where you live, and do the research wherever you decide to move to see what resources are available. Clubs and bars are only one small avenue for being social in the LGBT community; and as others said, not well suited given your sons age.
     
    #7 OnTheHighway, Sep 6, 2016
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  8. Spartan 117

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    Hello there,

    First off, let me commend you for being so supportive and considerate towards your son. :slight_smile: You're clearly a caring mum and it sounds like you've put a lot of thought into this. It is true that Scotland is meant to be the happiest place for LGBT people to live (according to a recent study), but that's mainly down to the fact that people in Scotland are generally happier with where they live. I'm very envious that you live in Edinburgh, not because it's gay-friendly, just because I think it's a great city! :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

    You'll find that in many of the big cities, there will be gay-friendly areas, simply because of their size. There's a bigger population, therefore there's a bigger LGBT population. :slight_smile: Of course, cities do come with their downsides too and it's perfectly understandable that you want to move to somewhere a little bit more rural and less hectic.

    My advice is to follow your heart and do what's right for your family. There are many positives and negatives when moving to a new place, and you should take them all into account. The main thing is that your son has your understanding support, I think that will ultimately be more important than nearby access to a gay bar. :icon_wink Unfortunately, everywhere will have some ignorant people and it's impossible to fully protect your children from that. However, you can't assume that everyone in rural or semi-suburban areas are going to be homophobic. :slight_smile: I'm sure that, with your help, your son will find a support network of friends wherever you go.

    A few years ago I moved from London to the Isle of Wight (a very conservative island) and while the gay community is somewhat non-existent here, I've been perfectly happy and haven't experienced homophobia. Funnily enough, I recently went on a date with someone from Cheltenham and they didn't have any complaints about homophobia. Cheltenham isn't far from Bristol by train, either. I think wherever you go, if your son is determined to visit a LGBT hotspot, he'll find a way to get there!

    Lastly, it's completely understandable that you want to protect your son from people who are going to react negatively to his sexuality. Unfortunately, this isn't always going to be possible. You're not wrong in saying that it will be easier to come out to people when he is older, but it's important that he understands that he shouldn't be ashamed of his sexuality. It's quite disheartening for a young person to hear "It's okay for you to be gay, just don't tell anyone.". I think the best thing you can do is prepare him for the fact that not everyone is going to understand but those who matter do.

    You're doing absolutely the right thing by surrounding him love and support. This means that when (and indeed, if) he ever experiences ignorance, it won't matter to him as much because he knows you have his back.
     
  9. Robert

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    The truth is that there is homophobia everywhere and your son will never be completely safe from it no matter where you move.

    I had a woman at the Hilton hotel in Brighton verbally abuse me and my boyfriend and then her husband threaten to knock me out all because we were gay and in the same swimming pool as them.
     
    #9 Robert, Sep 6, 2016
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  10. tgboymom

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    Hi Minny!

    I don't know anything about the areas you are talking about, but I have a child! lol My kid is trans, but this has nothing to do with that.

    As far as coming out to trusted people.. I think you're absolutely right, especially at this tender age. Most of us do not discuss our sexuality at that age. We see it as private. True friends won't care one way or the other, bullies will use it against him. He can tell people as he sees fit, when he sees fit.

    When my kid was in kindergarten in our state in the USA, the child study team referred him for testing. It was found he had an unusually high IQ so they had recommendations for his education. That state offered a class one day a week in a "think tank" sort of atmosphere in another town not so close by. :frowning2: His father and I had to make a decision as to what was best for him, so we researched and found a state which groups children homogeneously rather than heterogeneously in the public school system.

    We packed up, sold the house, and moved 1300 miles and raised him there where he was free to explore his talents. It was a good move. He had opportunities he would have never had in our home state. He had opportunities we couldn't have afforded to give him in our home state.

    If I was in your situation, I'd probably look at it the same way. If possible, I would move or not move to an area that was conducive to his safety and security and education while allowing him to be who he is. It's amazing how creative children can be when we encourage them to express themselves! :slight_smile:

    Good luck
    God be with you all
     
  11. Robert

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    I really think you are wrong here. 14 year olds, in general, think about and discuss relationships all the time. Its an age when you're thinking about girlfriends and boyfriends and the pressure is on you to have one and to show an interest in the topic of kissing etc. And soon, in a few years, there will be talk of full on sex... And "oh havent you had sex yet? I have!" "Oh my god, you havent even had a girl/boyfriend yet? Haha" - that sort of bragging and bravado is almost commonplace amongst 16+ year olds.

    Now Im not saying that these teenagers all go out and have sex and relationships but they talk about them a lot and they are put under a lot of pressure to be involved in that sort of thing - even if its just to talk about it.

    So, no, its not true that out sexuality isnt discussed. Its likely that you just never noticed it because talking about boys is just a normal innocent thing that girls do all the time. Or maybe your culture, in the US, is more different from ours in the UK than I thought? Either way, I really do believe that you are wrong.

    So, if he does hide his sexuality (which I expect he will to some extent - I think most of us on this forum all have hidden ourselves at school) then he will be actively hiding it. Make no mistake.
     
  12. tgboymom

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    Hey.. yea.. I get it. I was a kid once. I talked about things with my best friend. I just didn't meet someone and announce... HEY.. I'm straight and I made out with so and so. That's why I agree that that he should discuss these things only with those who he trusts.. in his time, when he's comfortable in a friendship. I didn't talk to people just because they were my own age. I spoke with people with whom I had a sincere friendship.

    I must be out of date here.. showing my age. Well.. I don't know. My kid is 30 and only discusses his transgender with people he considers friends. I think that's appropriate. He's a lot younger than I am. I tell him that what's in his pants is no one's business unless he chooses to make it their business. No?
     
  13. HappyGirlLucky

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    I actually agree with the main point you are trying to make in your post, but I have to admit it came off as a little insensitive to my ears (or eyes, as it were :lol:slight_smile:. You can announce your sexual orientation to a new acquaintance without the discussion leading to sexual topics. For many of us it is a part of our identity in a much larger sense than just who we are attracted to, as we are also part of a large community with which we may identify.

    It is not unlike being open about being a Christian, where you may bond with people over your faith and shared experiences with religion, except we bond over our shared life experience as it relates to being a minority due to gender and/or sexual orientation instead. Some people really enjoy that, while others prefer to keep it to themselves, it comes down to personal preference. I wear a rainbow bracelet in the way a Christian might wear a cross necklace to display their faith.

    I hope this did not come off as harsh in any way, I certainly didn't mean for it to. I have read your previous posts around here and I know you are an amazing mother to your son and otherwise really supportive too. :slight_smile: I just wanted to share my perspective on the matter.

    But now to the actual topic at hand. Minny, I agree with what tgboymom said, he should only talk about it with people he feels comfortable with, but it should be his choice who he wants to entrust with the information. The world is also very different from what it was even 10 years ago and from what Spartan 117 said, it seems like whatever you choose to do, you will not have that much to worry about over there.

    The best you can do is, again like Spartan said, to prepare him for people who are not always nice. With a loving home like yours he will always have a place to feel safe, and that is by far the most important thing for him right now. I know I said it in one of my previous posts but it is worth reiterating: you are such a great mom! :slight_smile:
     
    #13 HappyGirlLucky, Sep 6, 2016
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2016
  14. Minny

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    Thank you so much for all your thoughtful responses: I've read them all carefully and am so moved and touched that you have each taken time to think of me and my lovely son.

    I have taken it all on board and it's been incredibly helpful to read everyone's perspective.

    Thank you HappyGirlLucky for saying I'm a good mum: I really, really appreciate that. And for your insightful advice. I think coming out and making this new friend from NZ (I mentioned in another thread he's met online) has really boosted my son's confidence and he seems really happy.

    I have always told him that he's great as he is because even before he came out he was 'different' from the majority due to being 'gifted.'This makes him really fun to be around as he's sharp and witty. But not everyone his age has appreciated him at all for who he is. He felt very overwhelmed at first at having - as he said: to deal with this (being gay) on top of everything else'.....I told him not to panic, everything is going to be fine, his life is going to be great. Yes, he may suffer prejudice but he will be able to handle it.

    Thank you tgboymum, for your 'mum perspective.' That is very helpful to see it through your eyes. I do understand what you are saying that when we were young we didn't announce that we were straight. But that's because everyone assumes everyone is straight so one doesn't 'have' to announce it. But I do understand the underlying point you make. Thanks for your advice about moving to an area which will help my son in all aspects of his life.

    Many thanks Robert: that is what of course I am worried about: we know 2/3rds of teens are bullied at school because of being gay. Luckily my son isn't at school, but still as a mum you want to protect (not coddle!!:slight_smile:) one's child. My son definitely has a clear idea that he shouldn't hide who he is - no way!

    Thank you Spartan 117, I was fascinated about your story that you moved to the quite conservative and non-urban Isle of Wight - that is so reassuring to hear.

    I completely hear the message - and agree wholeheartedly - that my son must never be told to 'not tell anyone'. I certainly would never tell him that. I was just wondering (and I posed this question in another thread) that if total strangers came up to him (say at a sports club while he was playing squash) and asked: 'Are you gay?' If he should feel he has to tell them if he doesn't want to. Would that be denying his sexuality? I'm not sure.

    This is a contentious issue, I think. My feeling is he should say what he wants to say and what makes him most comfortable. Remember we're talking teens here who can be very taunting and cruel. Anyway, I've talked it over with him and he says he feels pretty confident about who he wants to tell and who he doesn't want to tell....so it's his call.

    Thanks so much for your kind comments about my supporting my son - that means a lot. Also your point that even if he is subject to homophobic bullying, that his home-life and the love and support of his family will enable him to cope. That's such a reassuring thing to say. Thank you.

    Thanks OntheHighway for your input - that's great. Of course, I wasn't just thinking of bars...I was thinking really more of a larger gay community but as Spartan 117 has said, one needn't be fearful of rural areas where such a community may be very small or non-existent. I don't even know why I was worrying about bars etc, since my son is only 14! Talk about over-preparing for the future! :slight_smile: Thanks so much for your advice.
     
  15. blightedsight

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    Except, kids, particularly teens have always talked about their sexual preferences in their own way.
    You make the comparison of "hey, I'm straight and made out with so and so", as being something not done, however no one does that and its not what Robert is saying. What you most likely did do, though, is talk to your 'girlfriends' or new classmates as a way to bond in school about your school crush or which Beatles member you fancied. That is something that is denied to people who are in the closet, unless they lie.
    14 year olds most certainly discuss these things as a general rule.
     
  16. Goldensun

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    As a single father of two young girls, I just want to say how what an amazing parent you are, Minny. Lots of people have addressed your individual questions and points, so I just want to say that you're doing everything a parent should do to support your children. You're taking responsibility for his emotional and physical health, you're offering him your love and support, and you're thinking through the impacts on him of deciding to move away or not. It sounds like you're letting him know that you love him just the way he is without any kind of judgement and you have a lot of empathy for him and his situation. I can't imagine the courage he must have needed to come out to you and the family - but his courage comes from somewhere and most likely it comes from knowing he is loved and supported by his family.
    So often parents let their children down when their children need them the most. But you're taken on the challenge and are helping your son to feel OK just the way he is.
    Respect.
     
  17. Minny

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    Gosh, thanks Goldensun, thanks so much for that - it brought a little tear to my eye. It means a lot. :slight_smile:
     
  18. Quem

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    Hey Minny,

    You're an amazing mother, I'm sure he must be very happy to have a supportive mum like you! :icon_bigg

    I think that most important things have been said already, but I'd like to give my perspective as well. :slight_smile:

    If my parents would not move because of my orientation, I would actually not like it. Especially if it the decision has been made without me knowing about it. I would most definitely understand their reasoning, but I would think that it should not matter. When I was 14, I think I would dislike such a decision even more than now. :stuck_out_tongue_closed_eyes:

    I think it's important, if you really consider not moving, to discuss it with your son. Perhaps he really likes the idea of moving to smaller place, or perhaps he doesn't (for other reasons).

    Anyway, you're very considerate, which is a good thing! I cannot emphasise enough how glad I am to see people being so accepting! :icon_bigg

    Cheers,

    Quem
     
  19. Minny

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    Thanks so much Quem, I really appreciate your lovely words.

    And also your advice. I don't think my son cares where he lives - we've been in two minds whether to go or stay for a while now. But then since my son came out last week, I had worried about small towns as I thought they might be less accepting/isolating for my son.

    But having read the advice here, I realise that this isn't necessarily so at all. I still haven't decided but feel reassured that my son will be fine where ever we move.

    Thanks so much.
     
  20. tgboymom

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    Please.. enlighten me! How am I being insensitive? I do need to know this. Christianity aside, please, because my thoughts have nothing to do with that. Was I wrong for discussing my intimate experiences that I had with boys only with those whom I trust? (Please keep in mind that some of my friends were gay boys, and they shared theirs as well).

    This post isn't about me at all, but saying that I'm insensitive leads me to believe that I am being insensitive with my own child and I REALLY NEED TO KNOW HOW I'M DOING THIS, so I can correct it. Am I wrong for telling my kid not to bring it up with strangers.. especially those who can be dangerous, and limiting this talk to the friends in his circle?

    Please.. you are welcome to send me a private message as I do NOT want to hijack this thread. I'm working so hard to be a loving parent and have not joined PFLAG because I'm afraid of saying the wrong thing.

    It did come off as a tad accusatory... so I need to know what I did "wrong". Keep in mind, I was referring to my experience of raising a teenager... not an LGBT teenager.. but any teenager. I was not aware of the parenting differences between having a cis-gender, straight teen vs a trans, LGB teen. I'd be interested in whatever criticisms that you may have, Happygirllucky. Thank you in advance for for any advice you have to give.

    Mom