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Is soy really as bad as I keep hearing?

Discussion in 'Physical & Sexual Health' started by MusicIsLife, Apr 21, 2010.

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  1. MusicIsLife

    MusicIsLife
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    I'm Vegan, so I drink a lot of soy milk, I eat a lot of tofu and a lot of Miso.

    I've heard the SOY IS BAD STAY AWAY FROM IT! side, though I am hesitant to take these articles as fact, because for all I know it could have been funded by the dairy industry.

    That being said, I don't live on just soy products, i try to keep it balanced with almond milk, seitan, beans and nuts as well for protein and such.

    So is it really -that- bad, or is it all exaggerated by the dairy companies?
     
    #1 MusicIsLife, Apr 21, 2010
  2. RaeofLite

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    I have no idea, but I would like to know as well. I'm a pescetarian, meaning I am a veggie who eats fish/seafood but no other meat. So... I eat a lot of soy too.
     
    #2 RaeofLite, Apr 21, 2010
  3. Johnnieguy

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    It can't be as bad as high fructose corn syrup..
     
    #3 Johnnieguy, Apr 21, 2010
  4. rebz

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    Not surprinsingly, many of the studies that find soy to be harmful were funded by the dairy industry. Studies that find no danger in soy consumption don't make headlines simply because they aren't interesting and "newsworthy." When's the last time you saw this headline: "BREAKING: Study Reveals Apples Safe to Eat."

    In fact, NIH recommends eating soy daily as a source of protein.
    http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/007204.htm
     
    #4 rebz, Apr 21, 2010
  5. Étoile

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    I read somewhere that too much soy consumption in males can cause breast development and increased estrogen.
     
    #5 Étoile, Apr 21, 2010
  6. Chandra

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    I've read lots of the anti-soy phytoestrogen arguments, but I also recently read one that claimed that the hormone-mimicking substances in soy are actually good for you. Who knows. As with everything, it's probably not a good idea to have excessive amounts, but it's likely fine in relative moderation.
     
    #6 Chandra, Apr 21, 2010
  7. Shevanel

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    There's always going to be a study that says everything is bad for you. No matter how bad they actually are.

    Just wait for it. "Study find Air to be life threatening to consume". xD
     
    #7 Shevanel, Apr 21, 2010
  8. Chip

    Chip
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    There are a lot of reasons why soy products aren't the best for you. The nonprofit I used to work for was one of the earliest to sound the warning, some 15 years ago, based on some solid research that WASN'T funded by the dairy industry or others with an ax to grind.

    In addition to the hormone issues (which may or may not be real, depending on whose study you read), there are two other very alarming issues. The first is that there are enzyme inhibitors in soybeans that have in a number of studies been shown to inhibit immune system function. It's not that it kills your immune system, but it does seem to reduce immune function, which may have implications in the development of some serious diseases.

    The second, and in some ways, potentially more concerning issues is the fact that about 90% of the US soybean crop is controlled by Monsanto, an enormous chemical company, and uses their patented, genetically altered soybeans. The soybean itself is actually registered with US EPA as a pesticide, since Monsanto has engineered the pesticide right into the DNA of the soybean. Supposedly the pesticide is safe for humans to eat, but there are no long-term safety studies, and, additionally, the safety studies that are there are based on "average" soy consumption, which is much, much lower than what a typical person trying to be thoughtful about eating would consume. And there is alarming data about short-term research that is starting to show up.

    For all these reasons, I'd suggest avoiding them if possible. If you wish to continue using soy products, insist on those made from organically grown soybeans, and try to limit your intake.

    If you're looking for a good replacement for milk or soymilk, almond milk is one choice, but rice milk is an even better choice; lower in fat and better for you. There are also rice milk-based ice cream, and rice-based protein powders.
     
    #8 Chip, Apr 21, 2010
  9. Numfarh

    Numfarh Guest

    Genetically engineered plants are not pesticides and I haven't found any readily available websites published by the EPA to imply that soy is on the list of pesticides. What a load of phooey. And for that matter, organically grown plants can be genetically altered; it's only in their growth that synthetic pesticides and fertilizers are restricted. So soya grown in the USA is actually less likely to be exposed to toxins because of its new and improved genetic code.

    Stop spreading falsehoods about genetically-altered foods just because you watched Food Inc. :dry:

    As for this controversy over hormones, there is a lot of conflicting evidence. One group likens it to BPA found in plastic baby bottles where another group points to the 30-50grams of soy consumed by the average Chinese person a day with no apparent harmful effects. Take the time, read scientific papers and don't believe the general population (they are so rarely correct in these cases).
     
    #9 Numfarh, Apr 21, 2010
  10. biisme

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    I don't know what you consider "readily available" to be...but all I had to do was to type into google "soybean pesticide engineered" and I came up with a bunch of sources that say that soy in the US has bean engineered to be herbicide-tolerant, by the company Monsanto. And, in fact, the first page that came up was wikipedia with a quite lengthy article on it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roundup

    This is another lengthy article/study about "Impacts of Genetically Engineered Crops on Pesticide Use in the United States: The First Thirteen Years".
     
    #10 biisme, Apr 21, 2010
  11. adam88

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    Herbicide resistant does not equal "contains pesticides in the genetic code".
     
    #11 adam88, Apr 22, 2010
  12. Numfarh

    Numfarh Guest

    Alright. So I was looking for the wrong thing. From what I understood from Chip's post, he was implying that the EPA listed soybeans as a pesticide. They do not; your links do not provide any evidence to support that claim.

    What your links claim is that the soybean has been engineered to resist herbicides, potentially supporting an increase in the usage to kill weeds. That wasn't the initial claim being made and I take no issues with objections to overuse of herbicides/pesticides. I furthermore dislike monopolies as I feel they stunt free-market competition.
    Heck, I'm as pro-organic as many others on this forum.
    I only object to falsely pinning genetically engineered foods as inherently dangerous when it is the chemicals that are being used to treat certain crops that propose the potential threat. In fact, your second link seems to describe engineering pesticides into plants as a good thing as it would drastically reduce the amounts of pesticides needed (read the bit about Bt crop efficiency).
     
    #12 Numfarh, Apr 22, 2010
    Last edited by a moderator: Apr 22, 2010
  13. Mysterons

    Mysterons Guest

    I know there's been some controversy lately over the toxicity of a certain herbicide called glyphosate which is used on soy crops, but I admit I haven't really done much research on the matter.
     
    #13 Mysterons, Apr 22, 2010
  14. Pepsi

    Pepsi Guest

    Well here in New York Joey.....................................................
     
    #14 Pepsi, Apr 22, 2010
  15. Chandra

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    Actually, the fats in nuts are good for you. Which is good, because rice milk tastes like gack.
     
    #15 Chandra, Apr 22, 2010
  16. MusicIsLife

    MusicIsLife
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    Agreed on that note. Rice Milk is awful.
     
    #16 MusicIsLife, Apr 22, 2010
  17. Chip

    Chip
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    To be picky, soybeans are legumes, not nuts :slight_smile: And yes, fats in nuts can be beneficial, and our bodies must have an adequate amount of fats to function and be healthy. My only concern in talking about the fat in soy is that, on the whole, the majority of Americans have far more than adequate levels of fats already, so adding more in the liquid we drink and so forth isn't the best for most people :slight_smile:
     
    #17 Chip, Apr 22, 2010
  18. Chip

    Chip
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    And I was wrong as well. it's potatoes and corn, not soy, that are currently registered with the EPA as pesticides.

    And actually, I haven't seen Food, Inc., but I have read a bunch over the years about Monsanto and it's pretty clear they are an evil, evil company, and it's also clear that most of the Monsanto genetically modified products currently on the market have not been adequately tested for safety in various situations.

    I'm not sure about the US government's standards for organic food labeling, so I'll take your word for it that organically labeled food can be genetically modified; the USDA organic standards got so watered down by the time lobbyists paid off congress it's amazing they are as good as they are. But I do know that the 3 or 4 independent certifying authorities for organic food prior to the USDA standard did not permit genetically altered seeds or plants.

    Also, for the record, I'm not inherently opposed to genetic alteration; it certainly can have some upsides. But I believe it should be exhaustively tested in all sorts of situations for many, many years, and there should probably be some sort of worldwide consensus on how to do this, since the risks of something going wrong, particulary with some of the shady shit that Monsanto is doing, are pretty high.

    So to sum up, I do know that Monsanto controls about 90% of the soybean crop in the US, that Monsanto has a godawful reputation for putting stuff out there that is not adequtely tested so we cannot be certain of the safety of it, and for that reason, buying commercial soy products and consuming them in significant quantity is probalby not the safest idea.
     
    #18 Chip, Apr 22, 2010
  19. Chandra

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    I meant the fats in almonds (which actually aren't true nuts either; for that matter, nor are most of the things we call nuts).
     
    #19 Chandra, Apr 22, 2010
  20. Starburst

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    No. Soy is good. Just plain good. :slight_smile:
     
    #20 Starburst, Apr 23, 2010
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