In denial I think and struggling with affection, how to deal with this?

Hello everyone.

I am from the UK, I am 30 years old and I am gay. I have been out since I was 14 and have NO issues at all with my sexuality. I am posting on behalf of a lad that I am currently in a relationship. He is 21 and I am his first (sexually and partner wise).

I met him back in August when I joined the gym after my friend who also happens to be a personal trainer at the gym introduced me to him in a way as "This is Richard, he fancies you" sort of thing! Very embarrassing lol. I fancied him back then and my gaydar kind of said to me that there was something about him. Other people who knew him at the gym also said that they thought he was gay as he never has any luck/confidence with girls despite being very attractive. He is very quiet as a person, shy, non confident, doesn't drink or go out clubbing etc and is fully focused on how he looks/what he eats being a personal trainer etc. The gym is the place he goes to unwind.

We started chatting from August over fb messenger and text and I questioned if he was gay, he said to me he was straight but he sometimes felt he was gay due to the luck he had with girls he thought he must be gay! (Signs already showing to me that he was curious). I invited him over a few times but he always cancelled last minute. Anyway in December I was having a party at my house for my birthday and I invited him. He asked if there would be any girls at the party, I said there would be a few but all were taken however he should still come and socialise and get to know some new people as his friends were not very good people who take the piss out of him for not drinking and being different and not the normal party animal they are.

Anyway the party night came, he was looking fwd to it, he even had some mulled wine. He seemed to relax and start talking to people something he doesn't normally do he says. I think the drink relaxed him. I and other people began to notice that he was constantly looking at me when I wasn't looking, checking me out when I was dancing about etc. We were all sat on the wall outside and I was sat on his lap on the wall and he had his arms around me which was nice. Everything was relaxed. The end of the party I questioned that he was looking at me and he said its just because he wished he could be more like me. I left it at that as perhaps he was looking at me because it could mean he fancied me/wanted to be as confident as me etc. That night we shared my bed as no other space in the house. We had a cuddle which he said was nice but strange as was used to that with girls.

Since that night we started to spend more time together other than seeing each other at the gym, he also started to train me at the gym as my other friend had left to work somewhere else. He started to stop at my house once a week or so, we get on really well have good times. He started to question his sexuality at this point (Dec/Jan) he said to me he had these feelings for 10 years since high school and always felt like he had never fitted in anywhere with his friends etc. He said he felt he could be his self around me and that he was relaxed. He admitted that he had a crush on me but he could never see himself being with me because I was his client at the gym (denial to avoid the truth I put this down to) anyway we have gotten closer and closer. Then at the end of January I had met his parents who assumed he was gay and asked him in front of me if we was together etc and they were 300% supportive, excellent I think he was overwhelmed at their response. He still identified himself as bi that he liked girls but he also was attracted to lads. This is something I said but I really knew I was gay, it was a coping mechanism and softened the blow from being fully gay. We have messed about and had a play in the bedroom, we kiss and he enjoys this, but he never instigates he prefers to be led.

Were now in March and the week before valentines day we was out having a meal and he decided that was the night he wanted to "come out" he chose to do this on fb and wrote a very well constructed status which had over 150 likes and 120 comments of support! He tagged me in this saying he was with me, things moved pretty fast from that point then when the day after he decided that we should change relationship status, I thought initially he meant just take the single bit out and leave it blank but he changed it to in a relationship then he put in a relationship with me. All this is going at his own pace I am letting him make the moves so that I know he is comfortable with things etc. I haven't said oh its too soon etc in case he felt I was rejecting him and I didn't want to confuse him.

People around him who know him say they have never seen him happier, he says is is so much more happier in himself, he is more confident and outgoing and his parents seem to like me and have said themselves "welcome to the family" which is all really nice. For him up to this point life should be pretty amazing. However he holds back on his feelings, he only says something back if I say it first. He doesn't show affection unless I show it first. He finds it very hard. However he says that he would show affection towards a girl so its not an issue with knowing how to show it but says its because he is struggling to adapt to with a guy. I have allowed for this and try not to pressure him however sometimes I do need to have a gentle talk with him about things as I feel sometimes he doesn't move forward or will hide behind the "struggling to adapt" to avoid it.

Since he came out to everyone in a great way, he has learned that his dad has cancer, then he found out his dad is dying from the cancer (prostate primary which has now spread to his spine) so he's got that to deal with at the moment. I'm being as supportive as I can which I know is appreciated I am just being there for him but I also don't want him to take steps back he needs to maintain the level he is at for himself to keep himself happy.

We have had a few chats this last few weeks about how he displays affection. He is turned on by things in the bedroom and he is adamant he enjoys it and im sure he does but he is just not comfortable in this area yet which to me at this stage lust should be taking over (even before he found out about his dad) the first time we did anything he was exploring different things and then he seemed to ease off perhaps because I take the lead and instigate?? If he's upset he wont say or he will go along with something if he thinks its easier even if he doesn't agree. For example the other week he told me he loved me because he thought its what I wanted to hear, and naturally I said this back to him so he didn't feel rejected and of course I am very fond of him. This should be the nice bit of the relationship. However a week later he back tracked and said that he didn't feel that way yet and said he said it because he thought I wanted to hear it.

Anyway the other day he was being moody and quite cold towards me so I had another chat with him about this as he will not talk about his feelings he finds it very hard so he closes up so you have to do it face to face or he will avoid texts or calls. I've asked him many times if this is what he wants and he says its what he wants he also comes to mine and keeps to plans he doesn't come up with excuses and we have great times together and lots of laughs. He says we have similar outlook on life and viewpoints and he says he wants to be with me so I am confident that this is the case as he doesn't avoid being with me. The only issue is he is having is with the affection that he has shown for girls. With me it almost seems forced or only reciprocates it if I instigate it first. He's done it with girls so I would have thought he would have been able to adjust to that quite easily especially as he is out to everyone in such a big way, he's gone so far on this journey I am really proud of who he is now etc.

When we spoke the other day I questioned "are you sure your gay/bi" and he said he is etc. Then I spoke some more about his affection and how he wont instigate when lust really should be the emotion that is taking over at this point in a relationship so I said "I don't think your gay" he said "I thought I was but i'm not" it hit me straight away then that "he's in denial to himself" and he's been feeling this for a few weeks but hasn't really understood it. He's blocking his feelings out (his words) as they are with a guy. I explained why I thought he was in denial and that he needs to look at the positives of who he is now and who he was before he admitted to himself who he was and he agreed he's in a much better place and much happier now. After we spoke he said he felt so much better for talking about things and realised that it is denial, I said that even after you have come out its still normal to feel denial as your still getting used to your feelings. He said he's going to start being more affectionate towards me but I have said I don't want you to do this because you are feeling that your upsetting me you need to do it because you want to do it and because it feels right. I don't want it to feel forced. The thing is after the love thing I'm kind of reluctant to believe everything he says because of the fact he agrees with things because he struggles with his feelings. I've told him this he said he just needs to get his head around things and process it all. He knows he can be affectionate and I have seen this when it has come natural from him when he's had his guard down for example when he's asleep he will cuddle into me or when he's really happy that day and on a natural high after receiving good news he will kiss me and be affectionate but then majority of time he can be a little wary unless I instigate.

I am pretty certain it is denial & when I look back at the journey he has come on its pretty much normal stuff but when your actually a part of someone's journey I just need clarity to know what I am doing is right. I am trying so hard to just take it slow but I also have to consider my own feelings and also to keep him moving at a pace. He's already said there is no way he would have done this without me because I have so much patience and understanding of him. He says he thinks the world of me and I am very important in his life and he cares deeply about me which is lovely. Will the affection balance out once he accepts himself properly. I've tried to stand back and not instigate things but nothing happens but this is his confidence I think. I am going with denial and acceptance within himself. He says he prefers men to women now which is something he wouldn't have said before. Is it just time that is needed?

Your opinions/suggestions please. I don't think I have missed anything off but feel free to ask any questions.

Kind Regards
Rich.

 

Sorry I didn't mean it to come across that way I guess that's what getting into my used from other peoples opinions who I know who are gay. & because that's my opinion of how I felt then I guess it's easy to presume. Hence I've come here for advice as don't wanna mess this up

Thanks for the heads up.

---------- Post added 11th Mar 2014 at 01:51 PM ----------

I do care enough to wait for him for sure which is why I don't wanna mess this up. I gues we all need some guidance from time to time.

 

Yeah I agree I think it's just a matter of time for him to deal with it all in his own time etc... I know how he can be so I know it's not a case of he he can't show affection or communicate etc, he's not great at discussing feelings but when he does he is clear and understandable etc

 

Thank you. That makes sense and does seem similar. I think he sees me as a confident outgoing person and likes that so there's nothing wrong with they but he puts himself down so much. I say to him there nothing wrong with being shy in fact I think it's kind of cute in him. It doesn't bother me in that situation, I just think he needs to stop being so hard on himself and just accept that time will solve most things. Today he said to me at lunch that he is struggling with his feelings. I said to him "are the feelings there though?" He responded they are he is just struggling to process them. I guess everyone is different and I need to appreciate that a little more he doesn't deal with things as fast as I do tending to bury his head. That's just how he is I do feel he may always be like that but I think in time when his confidence shines through more I think he will level out a bit with that as has already started to happen. He stands up for himself more where other people are concerned and it's more areas he isn't confident in that he will hold back on. I said to him I don't mind instigating things as long as he is comfortable with them happening, I have told him I have a lot of time for him and will wait.

He just needs to try to (if he can) talk about his emotions a little more, if I understand then perhaps I can help him understand of he is confused. For him to come out to everyone and be supported and go into a relationship I guess he's done it a different way to me. Once I came out I was experimenting with other guys to see where I fitted in etc. He's dealing with things a slightly different way. To be fair though it's probably working out for the better as he has the utmost support from me with regards to his father etc which I guess is a big worry as we don't know how long he has got left etc. I think the last thing he would be doing is putting it about he's not that sort of person anyway think he's only slept with 4/5 girls upto 21? Not sure if that's classed as "not a lot" or not but he is a shy person in general.

He's a really nice lad to be with but he worries far too much about what others think and also he worries about hurting my feelings so he obviously thinks a lot of me. I guess he is just slowly coming to terms with things in his own way which when I listen to my heart makes complete sense and is clear to me. I need to stop speaking to my friends who some have asked "what I am bothering for" to which my reply is because I care and like him and I can relate to him. I guess they are speaking of what they would do when really were all different. Only me is in the relationship with him and I think things will he quite nice (as they are now) once he's accepted himself. Everyone else has but I think he is battling a little bit with the new emotions towards a man. I reassure him today to just let his feelings exist and let things fall into place and be himself. I think it helps and he says it does when I talk things out of him as he isn't able to put things into words unless it's over text message where he can think more in his own time. When I talk things out of him he says he feelsuch better as it helps him it's just very hard for me when I see him obviously thinking about something and trying to figure out what's troubling him. It could he anything from him, me, work or his father.

His mum has spoken to me at length about him and has said he really struggles to get into a new routine but once he's there he sticks at it. He's always been like this so I guess it's just working with him on that and appreciating how he works things out. She has also said that as a family they struggle to talk about feelings again that's not a problem for me I can handle that. Again it wouldn't work to both be exactly the same people. I guess I would like him to just take the lead occasionally but I guess that will eventually come in time as he says he's been that way with girls before.

Sorry for the long essay.

---------- Post added 11th Mar 2014 at 05:47 PM ----------

Thanks Todd. Yeah he said he fears rejection but he knows that I wouldn't reject him. I show him a lot of affection. The issue I guess we're facing is basic levels of affection it could be a kiss/cuddle upon him getting into the house. On the sofa I seem to say come up this end of the sofa so I can cuddle him. I guess he's taken on the female role and I'm taking the male role.

Back in January he asked me to top him (we only ever kiss and wank which is fine) I told him that it was too soon for him and he said he wanted to. So without wanting to reject him I did and it was uncomfortable for him and has put him off since. I explained it was too soon. He gets turned on from the usual things we do and he loves to kiss.. So I know it's not a problem there. But I guess it's because the basic levels of affection is what he's struggling on in my mind I'm thinking those levels should be there but then I'm thinking logically and that he's just struggling to get used to being with a guy. Believe it or not in public he shows affection more for example he will kiss me on public in the supermarket and he called my bluff in the pub when I said would you kiss me in here and he said try me! Something I have never experienced before with a guy which was funny and felt nice to me. All my ex's have had trouble showing affection in public but not in private. This is the other way round lol.

I don't want to come across wrong over this forum I do have his best interests at heart hence asking for advice I just guess I need to know am either doing right or wrong as don't want to mess it up. We have got an overnight spa break booked for next week which will be nice for us both to relax.

 

I'm thinking the differences in what you have said and what I have said are that one is direct as in THIS IS too soon for you and the other I am putting the question back at him as in are YOU sure this isn't too soon which may make him think I am doubting it. Tbh I can't remember which one I said to him but it was something along those lines. Am I reading what you asked right or wrong?

I've experienced rejection so many times before so I am very cautious towards partners as I would never want them to experience what I had. Rejection is awful.

Believe it or not I have actually already told him I would rather him try to put his feelings across be it come across badly or not it's better out than in I tell him. We also talk more over whatsapp or text about stuff like this and he comes across well on the whole. I guess if I don't understand then neither can he attempt to. I'm very open about my emotions and feelings which probably he then struggles with because he struggles himself which he's always said from day 1.

You didn't come across patronising at all it made complete sense.

 

Last night he was at my house, I decided to step back a bit to see if he would pick up the slack... We was sat on the sofa he made no attempt to put arm around me or to get cosy as I would instigate with him and he would follow. Of course I am not upset by this I have a lot of time for him. I asked him this morning if he would prefer me to instigate for now so that he doesn't feel awkward etc and he said yes he's finding it really hard. He said he will follow if I lead.

He's on his way back to mine for the night so we shall see how things go and if he's a bit more relaxed. It must be so hard for him.