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72 some hours in...

Discussion in 'Sexual Orientation' started by Benway, Oct 3, 2014.

  1. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Well, I'm back on the cyber gay-scene again. As you may know I was back on it about a week ago for over 48 hours and now I've made it 72 hours in, though I think I've been working through some of the problems in my head...

    ...as much as I'm disgusted by women, I'm in love with one. I haven't seen her in a long time and I kind of messed our "relationship" up when she essentially said I was pushover, I guess I wasn't "macho" enough for her.

    For the last three nights I dream about her, and I wake up confused, embittered and disgusted by my homosexual behavior, feeling like I'm not only betraying her, but myself as well. It's my vicious cycle, wash, rinse, repeat.

    Lonely is the night, isn't it? Billy Squire was right, it's when your demons come to light and your mind is not your own. It's like there are two minds inside my brain. Similar yet divided by a single, simple factor: sexuality. It hurts.

    But maybe it should.
     
    #1 Benway, Oct 3, 2014
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  2. seeking

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    Dreams are symbolic... So maybe it be worth a try to use a dream dictionary to translate them. If you are not sexually interested in women.. Why hold onto a woman that you can't fully be with? Doesn't she deserve to be with a man who is looking for a woman and is attracted to a woman? For a lot of people a romantic relationship entails sex.

    You can love someone and not have to be in an intimate relationship with that person. The person is just your best friend when you love him/her, but can't be sexual with the person.

    Are you still accepting your sexuality?

    I hope i understood your post correctly and that this helped a tad.
     
  3. Benway

    Benway Guest

    I tend to buy Jungian psychology more than I buy Freudian. I've never liked Freud, his work is too heartless, too cold and analytic and that's coming from me. As I've said I'm not of the religious kind, that is to say I don't believe that anything in any spirit world condemns homosexuality, quite the opposite, in fact, if you just look at the old gods, those stories are filled with it, opening it with wide arms.

    That said, I do prefer a "spiritual" approach to the idea behind dreams. I like to think everything is connected in one way or another, no matter how trivial. Whether or not that says I believe in any god or gods I cannot say. If you want to put it in scientific terms, I'm something of a hard determinist-- that is to say in extremely simplified terms: the scientific theory that everything is predetermined, to an extent.

    Am I still accepting my homosexuality? "Accepting" is a very... definite term. Let's just say I'm tolerating my own behavior for the time being. I must stress as I've repeatedly before, I am not homophobic, if I was, I wouldn't come to the LGBT community for help, I'd probably go to a doctor at one of those NARTH centers or something, or simply kill myself-- which I'm not going to do, as I've no desire to do so.

    Yes. She deserves better than me, not just sexually, but someone who is a better human being than I am. And though her face permeates my dreams every night and losing contact with her has haunted me every day since it happened I push on, knowing that as much I'd like a fairy-tale ending with her, I know it can never be and that's what hurts the most. I know I am not built for that, I just wish I could be.

    And it's not just about sex, hell, very little of it is. She and I would discuss it in depth, we came close to doing it once or twice but I'd put a stop to it. I have had sex with a girl, but that was someone else, someone who I didn't even really like who was turned on by the idea of taking my virginity and I felt that maybe in letting her do so it would make all of... this go away. It didn't, it made it worse and I've been spiraling down since.

    Maybe I can put it best in the words of a timeless song performed in Gregorian chant form...

    [YOUTUBE]4C5SKMajXEo[/YOUTUBE]​

    ...I've always thought what Bowie was trying to say was he was wishing for something he knew just simply couldn't be which if he could make it so would make him and the person of interest he sings of "heroes."

    That's how I feel.
     
    #3 Benway, Oct 4, 2014
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  4. seeking

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    Can't see the youtube... Might be because i am on an ipad. But, may i ask if i understood correctly...are you mourning the fact that you can't have a heterosexual relationship because of your sexuality and you are mourning the fact you can't have it with this woman because of your sexuality?

    It took me time to readjust my perspective... I was raised in a household where they felt homosexuality is a sin. I was never religious personally, but I was raised with the common ideal of getting married to a man and having children. I guess part of accepting my sexuality was accepting that my future will not look exactly like i was lead to believe.

    And when i say translate your dream i mean psychologically.. From a psych viewpoint. I don't believe dreams are something spiritual... I personally believe they are just the subconscious mind trying to display a message that the conscious mind is not ready to accept/face or the subconscious mind is trying to display a fact of a situation that the conscious mind is overlooking. I like freud and jung... I don't agree with absolutely everything each person has to say but i agree with a little from each person.

    I don't know you as a person personally, but i highly doubt you are a bad person/loser. I feel what everybody has to remember is that not everyone is meant for everyone.

    I would propose that you need to accept the past for what it is.. You can't change it. Stop kicking yourself because of your mistakes. You have learned from whatever mistakes you have made the future is there to show that you have grown as a person from your experience. Also think you need to work on self love. You are too hard on yourself.

    Have you also thought of seeking out counseling if you feel like you are spiraling down?

    Wish you the best.
     
    #4 seeking, Oct 4, 2014
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2014
  5. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Like I said, I'm not religious, I just like the idea of mythology and spirit worlds over science, which I find too cold. I don't even know if they're all that different.

    I've sought counseling, there was one LGBT therapist in my area I was seeing for awhile, but my insurance ran out and I can't afford to see him, anymore.

    It's not so much I'm mourning that I can't have a heterosexual relationship as it is that I'm so disgusted by what I am.
     
  6. seeking

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    Is there any lgbt centers in your area? They usually offer free counseling with the appreciation for any donations.
     
  7. Benway

    Benway Guest

    I'm not sure... Even if there were I'm not sure I'd feel comfortable going into one unless I was deep incognito-- I just don't want to be outed.
     
  8. seeking

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    When did you start suspecting that you are gay?
     
  9. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Over a ten years ago. Maybe before that, too. Why?
     
  10. seeking

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    Just was curious.
     
  11. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Does the amount of time mean anything important? Like, could that help in some way?
     
  12. seeking

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    I don't think it means anything definitive, but even though you feel you are not homophobic and are not religious. I am wondering what did you surroundings show about homosexuality? i know your parents are open minded/liberal however you put it. but, your surroundings, the society, you lived in can weave its way into your subconscious even though you do not practice it the hatred or discrimination.

    i mean suspecting it for 10 years.. idk when the hatred for self or for this aspect of self began. But, that is a significant amount of your life (as someone who consciously knows their sexuality) to have some form of disgust with self. May i ask what are you so scared of if you did come out? if you did accept this side of self? if you did change your perspective? because i highly doubt it is a fear of self but a fear of society. I could be wrong but a theory.
     
  13. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Well, I live in what used to be a fairly industrial community, steel mills, lots of factories-- all of which closed down over twenty years ago when (as my late Grandfather and my Dad put it "due to cheap overseas labor being better") but the area itself, despite having become fairly rural (lots of corn fields and farms, good fishing industry, we have a soda factory that's still booming) is pretty progressive, I live in a 'Blue State,' which is good, I'm a registered Democrat like the majority of the state and the area itself, there's three major gay bars in my vicinity alone.

    As for what makes me so disgusted and scared... As I've said, I had an openly gay bully in high school who was something of a passive/aggressive 'friend' to me after, and without going into details I'd rather not divulge, my relationship with him poisoned my self-image so badly that I grew to hate what I was so much, so that could play a big factor in all of it.
     
  14. nerdbrain

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    Benway I'm curious why you refer to yourself as "Questioning." Iit seems pretty clear from your own admissions that you are gay. Maybe reframing the issue from one of "what am I?" to "how do learn to accept myself?" would be helpful.

    There are some decent books on this topic i.e., "Loving Someone Gay" and Joe Kort's work.

    But if you persist in acting like there is some other option for you, it seems like you're going to be stuck in the loop.
     
  15. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Maybe, I think part of it is just wishful thinking. When you say 'reframing,' are you referring to CBT? That's cognitive behavioral therapy, a technique they've taught me time and time again inpatient and outpatient at the psyche wards, though it doesn't work well for me because I have this sort of hardwired opinion that it's just a way of lying to myself.

    I haven't looked into books on the subject in a long time, I always feel embarrassed at the checkout line at the library when I borrow them, but I suppose I could go incognito, which is how I've been going out, lately-- I wear a hat and sunglasses and dress in clothes I don't usually dress in to avoid being outed by anyone who may know my secret.
     
  16. Benway

    Benway Guest

    I'm just going to throw in an addendum...

    If this helps at all, a lot of this lies in postmasturbatory shame-- every time I finish, I feel like I've done something wrong. I think it could be because the first time I masturbated, which was at age 14, I didn't know what I was doing-- like, I literally didn't know what I was doing and when I had my first orgasm I thought I had injured myself and ran to the bathroom thinking I had started bleeding profusely from my penis only to find that it was white. I was utterly mortified by the experience and I think that it has something to do with my condition today.
     
  17. nerdbrain

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    I wasn't thinking of CBT specifically. But it's similar.

    I guess you seem to be stressing out over the "wrong" thing. If there is some real doubt about whether you're gay, sure that could be a problem. But if you're obviously gay why worry about it? (Apart from other peoples reactions)
     
  18. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Wow, weird, I didn't think this post was still alive... I was actually about to make an entirely new thread but I'll just post this here:

    I think I'm having some sort of breakthrough, or epiphany or whatever you want to call it. I just finished chatting with someone (a guy-- well, several guys) and I went ahead and did my business and finished up and I... don't feel bad right now (post-orgasm, I mean. I'm trying to say it politely), in fact, I feel kind of empowered and I'm not sure why.

    It's like, instead of deleting everything, the app, the pictures, the accounts, I'm at this weird point all of a sudden where I'm saying to myself: "Look man, just play around with the chat rooms or whatever until you get shit sorted out," and I'm telling myself I'm not going to feel bad about it and... it's working.

    So, with that, I'm cautiously optimistic. The shame, disgust and sadness could return at any time, but they might not, and it feels pretty damn good.
     
  19. nerdbrain

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    That seems like a reasonable approach. Bravo!
     
  20. Benway

    Benway Guest

    Yeah, it's going unusually well! I didn't realize but I'm way more than 72 hours in, twelve hours ago marked one week. I've orgasmed at least fourteen times since then and the shame isn't there, maybe because I'm just saying I need to get this sorted out.