see the light, but can't reach....

[escortwgn]

my story begins when i was 15. freshman at high school, i started haveing feelings towards guys. i didn't know what to think. so as with most teens, i ignored them. but it was so easy. it was only when i was stationed in germany that i saw the big picture. i was 18 then, now 21. it's being almost a year since i came out saying i'm gay(to myself). but it was only then i realized, that could be a problem. i'm military, and military/gay don't mix to well. i've being thinking for many long hours on telling one of my co-workers who also is my neighbor. but in doing so might hurt or end my career. thats my problem. i was hoping someone has heard of a similar situation, and shed some light on this situation. it's being very hard keeping this quiet. help

thanks justin

[confusedkid]

Well, you've made the first step, which is excellent. But you're right about the military/gay thing. If you are in the US army, I wouldn't tell anyone remotely related to the military. Coming out at this moment is not worth a courtmarshall. Wait until you're out of the army or we're able to get rid of the ridiculous "Don't ask, don't tell" policy (I'm working in on it!)

If you do feel the need to tell someone, I'd pick a person you're particularly close to. I can imagine that being the military stationed overseas it can be difficult to have close relationships with civilians but I don't know... I think telling any of your coworkers would be too large a gamble. If you do have a non-military friend you feel you can trust, I can tell you that most people's first coming out experiences aren't as traumatic as people think (at least that's the general concensus on the board). While it's true that some don't go too well, others see coming out as a huge relief...

Just curious: Do you plan on staying in the military as a career or did you enlist "just because"?

'Till later!

-CK

P.S. Welcome to the forums! I'm glad to see new people around!

[joeyconnick]

If you're in the US military, I feel for you. Check out Servicemembers' Legal Defense Network for info but be warned: it's not pretty.

That being said, most civilised nations' militaries don't have something as stupid as "don't ask, don't tell, don't pursue" and allow their queer citizens to serve openly. Canada, for instance, and the UK.

[confusedkid]

Originally Posted by joeyconnick

If you're in the US military, I feel for you. Check out Servicemembers' Legal Defense Network for info but be warned: it's not pretty.

That being said, most civilised nations' militaries don't have something as stupid as "don't ask, don't tell, don't pursue" and allow their queer citizens to serve openly. Canada, for instance, and the UK.

"Don't ask, don't tell" is just more proof that this country's more afraid of queers than foreign invasion... so much for national defense being our #1 priority... anybody read that article about how 5 Pentagon translators trained in Farsi, Arabic, and Urdu were let go b/c of "don't ask, don't tell"?

[escortwgn]

i haven't decided if to do the career or get out in 2007. but as for joining at the time i couldn't afford college so right after school went to the air force. i toltally agree..this "don't ask, don't tell" needs to be lifted. 'cause i'm moveing to england at the end of the month and i plan on exploring myself since the thought keeps popping in my head 'what if someone finds out?!'

i would say fear is like being back in iraq, but this seems a lot worse. i know a couple of guys who were given the boot just 'cause they were gay. thats the biggest fear. just normal people out doing what we can for our country but our lives, how we choose to live, we have to act this way. i'm str8 acting, so no one would suspect. but its hard living a lie. i'm only myself after work at home thats it.

whats that thing with the 5 pentagon people?

justin

[confusedkid]

Originally Posted by escortwgn

i haven't decided if to do the career or get out in 2007. but as for joining at the time i couldn't afford college so right after school went to the air force. i toltally agree..this "don't ask, don't tell" needs to be lifted. 'cause i'm moveing to england at the end of the month and i plan on exploring myself since the thought keeps popping in my head 'what if someone finds out?!'

i would say fear is like being back in iraq, but this seems a lot worse. i know a couple of guys who were given the boot just 'cause they were gay. thats the biggest fear. just normal people out doing what we can for our country but our lives, how we choose to live, we have to act this way. i'm str8 acting, so no one would suspect. but its hard living a lie. i'm only myself after work at home thats it.

whats that thing with the 5 pentagon people?

justin

Yeah, it is difficult to live a lie, but you don't have to live a lie as long as you're honest with yourself. It's kinda like what I do, I'm pretty straight-acting and if I don't want people to know, I don't tell them... Just because I don't tell people outright that I'm gay doesn't mean that I'm lying to them. I know who I am (well, kinda... still trying to work out the whole gay or bi thing hahaha) and that's good enough. So just because other people assume that you're straight isn't you living a lie, that's their assumption. Haha. I can see though how it could be a problem if your buddies want to go out drinking and pick up chicks and you just might not be all that interested ... the other thing is that I would probably slow or stop drinking because, really, there's no way that somebody can "find out" that you're gay unless you tell them (or you might say and do stuff while intoxicated that may lead people to believe you're gay...) so if you're worried about people knowing (especially military-type people) I'd make sure they just don't have an opportunity to find out...

As for the loneliness, I mean can't you just have friends without there being any sexual? There are other ways to satisfy your sexual urges (yeah, people have sex drives and sexual impulses and are generally horny and sexual release is just another natural process... and a fun one at that! ) Yeah, but "don't ask, don't tell" needs to be lifted. Oh, and remember, the "don't ask" part applies just as much as the "don't tell" so I wouldn't worry about people questioning you about your orientation, because, frankly, they can't. HAHAHA

As for the Pentagon story, 5 translators who were technically in the military (even tho they had DoD desk jobs) were discharged because they were openly gay in their community, etc. and there was a big debate in Congress about how ridiculous it is that we're letting people who have essential skills and want to serve their country go because of their sexual orientation. So yeah, that's that.

Hit us back!

-CK

[escortwgn]

hey thanks. it feels better to know that i can discuss this in a safe enviroment. i thought of coming out to my friends on base is gone, but i'm sure the right time will come. i understand what you mean with the living a lie, it's none of there concern. again thanks for everything

justin

[confusedkid]

Heya, well I'm glad we could help work some stuff out with you. But I would say that if this policy doesn't change in the next two years (and most likely it won't), I can't speak for you, but I'd get my discharge, get the VA to pay for school and just be done with the military so that I could feel like I could continue to live my life without hiding who I really am... but who knows, maybe some people really do like the military life? (I mean, who wouldn't with the hot uniforms and all... J/K!)

Anyway, have fun in England... you'll love it.

-CK

[escortwgn]

yeah again with staying or not undecided. but theres good news, i was talking for 'bout 2 hours with one of my very close friends from florida, and some how the topic came up and i came out to her. it felt great! i was a little nervous about it, but i felt it was the right thing to do. now it's the folks. it's going to be a while for them and the family. all southeren baptist. that can wait.

justin

[confusedkid]

Originally Posted by escortwgn

yeah again with staying or not undecided. but theres good news, i was talking for 'bout 2 hours with one of my very close friends from florida, and some how the topic came up and i came out to her. it felt great! i was a little nervous about it, but i felt it was the right thing to do. now it's the folks. it's going to be a while for them and the family. all southeren baptist. that can wait.

justin

CONGRATULATIONS! That's really great. Oh yeah, family can defintely wait, if you don't feel like it's the right time. My family's not religious, and is pretty liberal on social issues and I still haven't come out (officially) to them hahaha. But most of my good friends know and everything's all good.

Congrats, again!

-CK

[joeyconnick]

Originally Posted by confusedkid

Yeah, it is difficult to live a lie, but you don't have to live a lie as long as you're honest with yourself. It's kinda like what I do, I'm pretty straight-acting and if I don't want people to know, I don't tell them... Just because I don't tell people outright that I'm gay doesn't mean that I'm lying to them. I know who I am (well, kinda... still trying to work out the whole gay or bi thing hahaha) and that's good enough. So just because other people assume that you're straight isn't you living a lie, that's their assumption.

Uhm actually... being honest with yourself but not being honest with others is, technically, lying. Well by my standards, at least.

I mean, there is this whole notion of lying by omission. If you know someone is making a false assumption about you and you neglect to correct it because you don't want them to know the truth, that seems like lying to me.

Now that doesn't mean that lying is necessarily wrong (life is hardly that black and white), especially in a situation like you'll be kicked out of the military because of it, but I don't think we should pretend it's not lying. I mean, ultimately, if that's not lying, then really being closeted is no big deal, right? I mean, it's not really anyone's business, is it?

Well, wrong. It is just as much everyone's business who you're sleeping with as it would be if you were straight. I.e. straight people talk about their significant others and their relationships ALL THE TIME, so why shouldn't gay people get to or feel comfortable doing so? You never hear straight people saying "Oh, it's no one's business who I sleep with/what I do in my bedroom..." unless they're ashamed of who they're sleeping with or afraid of how people will react to the news of their relationship. Or if they're prudes, which is a whole other issue. *grin*

I just think it's one thing to avoid revealing your sexuality if you're worried for your life or livelihood vs. if you're worried about losing your heterosexual privilege. One is self-preservation and the other is vested self-interest. And it's always the latter people who complain about other gay people "flaunting" their sexuality when usually all that's happening is gay people are being just as unapologetic about their entire lives as straight people get to be about theirs without having to give it a second thought.